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  • Originally posted by drivesafe View Post
    Hi mullerwh, if you have an Optima D34 ( 55Ah ) and it is at 10.5v ( 0% SoC ) a new Prado, with the lower operating voltage will get the battery back over 95% SoC in around 1 hour.

    If you use your 25 amp DC/DC device, it will take over 2.5 hours.

    In both cases, there is no reason why you can not get that last 5% of charge into the battery.

    Even though it will take longer for an alternator to get that last 5%, it will still fully charge the Optima, but because your alternator can get the battery up over 95% much, MUCH sooner than any DC/DC device can, you will still end up with a fully charge battery in around the same time but for a lot less setup cost.
    Thanks very much Drivesafe. My 2010 GXL outputs 13.6 constantly with the current isolator setup without the diode/booster. What would the benefit be the of the diode/booster with my current almost constant output of 13.6v?

    Time to sell the BCDC1225 or build a battery box
    mullerwh
    Member
    Last edited by mullerwh; 08-03-2017, 11:57 AM.
    2010 Prado 150 GXL Diesel, Cooper AT3, ARB compressor, Catch Can, Redarc BCDC 1225, Projecta DBC150, Optima YellowTop and RedTop D34, Pioneer Backbone Platform

    Comment


    • Hi again mullerwh, if you were to fit one of Leigh’s Booster fuses, you would charge a flat Optima to over 95% in less than an hour and it would be fully charged in well under 2 hours.

      But if you have batteries in a caravan or camper trailer, they too would charge much quicker, without the need of a DC/DC device.

      DC/DC devices will charge batteries, and in some cases, will do so better than straight off an alternator, but in the vast majority of cases, there are better and cheaper ways to achieve better results, people just need to be made aware of what else is out there.

      Comment


      • I went with and ARB tray and a Supercharge Amptech D50Z battery + Narva 140A voltage relay + auto fuses.

        https://au.pinterest.com/pin/489344315747561601/
        https://au.pinterest.com/pin/489344315747561582/
        https://au.pinterest.com/pin/489344315747561620/
        https://au.pinterest.com/pin/489344315747561616/

        Comment


        • I installed an ARB battery tray yesterday and inserted a Century NS70T battery. The valve on the air con pipe was hard up against the battery. I removed the battery and rotated the Z bracket that holds the air con pipe about 5 degrees or so. (I had to drill a new hole for the locator on the bracket). This pushed the aircon pipe over about 5 to 10mm which gave me the clearance I was after. Has anybody else done this? Am I setting myself up for an aircon pipe failure down the track or am I going to get away with it do you think?

          Comment


          • Brains, I, for one, appreciate getting Drivesafe's view on matters. My impression is he knows what he is talking about and has taken considerable time to share his knowledge and expertise.

            Thanks Drivesafe, please keep sharing and thanks for taking the time to do so.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by drivesafe View Post
              DC/DC devices will charge batteries, and in some cases, will do so better than straight off an alternator, but in the vast majority of cases, there are better and cheaper ways to achieve better results, people just need to be made aware of what else is out there.
              Hi Gents,

              I've been analysing this thread as I'm going to drop a dual battery in my Prado. I need to get this set up right as I need the rear 240v outlet for my CPAP machine..its literally the air that I breathe.

              I was thinking of doing the battery tray and second battery with a wire running to the rear and locating a second point above the existing rear 220v outlet to keep the Circuit independent of the car circuit. Is there any benefit to me doing this? Or should I just rely on the existing car circuit and make sure I get the dual battery setup right up front..?

              I ran into a 4wd store to buy the bits and pieces only to be told I needed a DCDC Redarc Battery manager and that I should avoid the isolator setup.. my opinion after leaving the store empty handed and confused was that the sales rep was trying to upsell me.. I mean, I'm sure the battery manager is a sophisticated piece of machinery, but it is essentially a glorified battery charger with a bit more flexibility.. (am I wrong or ignorant?)

              I'm not running a camper, but will run work lights off the rack for camping.. and a fridge...The CPAP machine only runs for 8 hours a night and peaks at an exadgerated 5amp on startup before settling back between 1 - 3 amp depending on how hard its working, humidifier setting etc.. so I can manage it to be conservative past startup..

              If my maths are correct 8 hours x 5 amp = 40 amp hours required.
              Running a fridge at 5 amp hours peak load is relatively the same.. so for an overnight stay a 100 amp hour battery should be fine..?


              please, I'm happy to hear any suggestions as to how I can get a robust system without the bling..

              Comment


              • So I installed my Redarc BCDC1225D into my 2016 VX this week. used a Centrury 95Ah battery and Piranha battery tray. All good so far.

                I just wanted to let everyone know about the purpose build bracket i used from Out of Town 4WD Barnsley, NSW. They manufacture a SS bracket that fits between the front grill and radiator, out of the heat of the engine bay. It is designed to suit all Prado 150s from 09 onwards. Cost around $55 plus delivery, or pickup if you live locally. The thing I really like about this bracket is that is has two additional spaces where the Redarc 40AMP Midi fuses can be mounted right next to the BCDC. Very neat indeed. Made my install very easy and I highly recommended the product.

                I'll post some photos of the install when I get a chance.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Mototrans View Post
                  I'm not running a camper, but will run work lights off the rack for camping.. and a fridge...The CPAP machine only runs for 8 hours a night and peaks at an exadgerated 5amp on startup before settling back between 1 - 3 amp depending on how hard its working, humidifier setting etc.. so I can manage it to be conservative past startup...
                  Where are you measuring the current? You say it's a 240v machine so if you're measuring 1-3A at 240V then your maths isn't correct and I suspect you'll need a much bigger battery.

                  AB

                  Comment


                  • Hi Mototrans, as AB has posted, you have not supplied enough info to be able to help you.

                    Could you post up details of your specific CPAP machine and we can give you some relevant replies that may help you set up for what you need.

                    Also, if you have any idea, post up your likely drive times between overnight stops.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by 2016VX View Post
                      So I installed my Redarc BCDC1225D into my 2016 VX this week. used a Centrury 95Ah battery and Piranha battery tray. All good so far.

                      I just wanted to let everyone know about the purpose build bracket i used from Out of Town 4WD Barnsley, NSW. They manufacture a SS bracket that fits between the front grill and radiator, out of the heat of the engine bay. It is designed to suit all Prado 150s from 09 onwards. Cost around $55 plus delivery, or pickup if you live locally. The thing I really like about this bracket is that is has two additional spaces where the Redarc 40AMP Midi fuses can be mounted right next to the BCDC. Very neat indeed. Made my install very easy and I highly recommended the product.

                      I'll post some photos of the install when I get a chance.
                      Nice setup, that bracket would make life easier for mounting the DCDC charger.

                      Ideally though for max protection, the fuses should be located as close as possible to the positive terminal of each battery.

                      Comment


                      • It seems to be the flavor of the month to mount the charger in front of the radiator to
                        keep it cool and stop it throttling back due to high temperatures etc.

                        Most chargers are temperature compensated, ie they reduce their output voltage as
                        the ambient temperature increases, as the battery gets hotter it needs less voltage to
                        fully charge it. As such most charger manufactures recommend the charger be located as
                        close as possible to the battery being charged, ie in the same ambient temperature as the
                        battery being charged so that the charger can compensate as the temperature changes.

                        Some chargers have an external temperature probe that can be fitted to the battery being
                        charged should the charger be located in a different environment.

                        Reading the current literature for the Redarc chargers they no longer mention temperature
                        compensation but I would imagine their chargers are still doing it if they are providing the best
                        charging regime for the battery. It may therefore not be a good idea to locate the charger in a
                        cool air stream when the battery is located in a different location especially under the bonnet.
                        I note they do state charger should be located as close to the battery being charged as possible.
                        I would be asking Redarc if it is a good idea to mount as above.
                        HKB Electronics, manufacturer of the Alternator Voltage Booster, Silver 2008 D4D,Lifted,Underbody protection, Alternator Voltage Booster, Tiger Z winch, Lightforce DL, Air Horns, Tanami Drawers, Drop down fridge slide, Outback cargo barriers, Rotronics dual Battery system, Polaris GPS, HF/UHF/VHF, Radio speaker combiner, Long ranger water tank, Diff breathers, Inverter, Snorkel and others

                        Comment


                        • It was actually the NSW RedArc rep who pointed me to the supplier for this bracket.

                          I don't think there is anything wrong with mounting in the engine bay, afterall people have been doing it for years, but the problem is, Redarc recommend that the charger be installed as close as possible to the Aux battery, and as we know on a D4D Prado, the Aux battery is right next to the hot turbo charger. Redarc state "The unit will operate optimally below 55°C with good airflow. At higher temperatures the unit will de-rate output current up to 80°C where the unit will turn OFF ".

                          I have never measured it, but on a hot day in summer, I would bet the engine bay gets close to or above 80degC. There were a few days last summer that reached 45degC in Sydney and I bet my BCDC would have given up if I had it installed back then. Might be an experiment I do over the weekend. I have a digital thermometer with Max/Min readings (I use in my wine fridge). I'll find a way to mount it under the bonnet so I can see how hot it gets.

                          Comment


                          • The bottom line is does the charger modify its output voltage as the temperature rises or falls
                            as it should for correct charging of the battery, ie see temperature compensation of charging voltage for lead acid batteries? If it doesn't have inbuilt temperature compensation then this is not good for the battery and I would be looking at a charger that does. If it does then mounting the charger in a cooler environment to the battery will cause the battery to be overcharged and reduce its life.

                            Advising to fit the unit in front of the radiator is to overcome poor design of their charger as it
                            it can't cope with the heat, that is cool itself and it overheats and derates its output, this is a known issue can result in little or no charging in hot environments ie heading up north. If the charger needs to be mounted in a cool environment they should have an external temperature sensor for battery temperature monitoring.

                            If it doesn't have inbuilt temperature compensation then this is not good for the battery and I would be looking at a charger that does.
                            LeighW
                            Avid PP Poster!
                            Last edited by LeighW; 28-09-2017, 11:16 AM.
                            HKB Electronics, manufacturer of the Alternator Voltage Booster, Silver 2008 D4D,Lifted,Underbody protection, Alternator Voltage Booster, Tiger Z winch, Lightforce DL, Air Horns, Tanami Drawers, Drop down fridge slide, Outback cargo barriers, Rotronics dual Battery system, Polaris GPS, HF/UHF/VHF, Radio speaker combiner, Long ranger water tank, Diff breathers, Inverter, Snorkel and others

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by LeighW View Post
                              The bottom line is does the charger modify its output voltage as the temperature rises or falls
                              as it should for correct charging of the battery, ie see temperature compensation of charging voltage
                              for lead acid batteries? If it doesn't have inbuilt temperature compensation then this is not good for the
                              battery and I would be looking at a charger that does. If it does then mounting the charger in a cooler
                              environment to the battery will cause the battery to be overcharged and reduce its life.

                              Advising to fit the unit in front of the radiator is to overcome poor design of their charger as it
                              it can't cope with the heat, that is cool itself and it overheats and derates its output, this is a know
                              issue can result in little or no charging in hot environments ie heading up north. If the charger
                              needs to be mounted in a cool environment they should have an external temperature sensor
                              for battery temperature monitoring.

                              If it doesn't have inbuilt temperature compensation then this is not good for the battery and I would
                              be looking at a charger that does.

                              The Projecta IDC25 I just installed does have a temperature probe that should be attached to the battery case.

                              I mounted the unit behind the aircleaner, so in the corner between the right hand guard and firewall and even after the 40km commute to work the case is barely warm to touch. I guess slow low-range 4WD work may increase under bonnet temps due to lack of air flow. I'll see how it goes and consider moving it if required.

                              Comment


                              • There is a Catch22 in situations like this.

                                All DC/DC devices must be mounted as close as possible to the battery they are intended to charge.

                                Failure to do so can cure enough voltage drop, be it very small, but this can result in the battery being continually undercharged, but because of the temperatures being imposed on the DC/DC device if it is close to the battery, can again cause undercharging.

                                The alternative is, if the DC/DC device has a temperature monitoring probe, then the DC/DC device could be mounted in a cooler location and then fit extremely thick cables between the DC/DC device and the battery being charged by it.

                                Comment

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