Sunday Mail: 12/2/16 "$62,000 Prado buyer to sue on Vibrations"

[castlemaine Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close castlemaine]

I have the same complaint about my 3.0 litre 150 auto. It is just not as smooth as the prado 120 auto I replaced with vibrations etc. felt when highway cruising and also idles less smoothly. All in all disappointing and I complained at the 1000km service to be told it is still new and notify them at the 6 months service if still happening.

It's not an isolated problem and Toyota is aware of the problem. A mate of mine, in his 70s, bought one and has had acknowledgement from Toyota that there is a vibration but does not constitute a 'major issue'. So it's not his sensitive ears. He has been on Toyota's back for over a year.

He lives on the Sunshine Coast and has contacted and met Mr and Mrs Dewar after reading the article.

These people have spent their hard earned retirement money on a vehicle that they wanted to enjoy, only for it to be a bug bear. The fight has taken a toll on my mate but if Toyota thinks he's going to give in, they really haven't fought with this old Terrier Dog.

I'm happy with my 150 Prado but I'm a bit worried about buying another one.

Cheers

[JohnLynn Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close JohnLynn]

Why is getting anything out of Toyota worse than the proverbial blood from a stone? It makes my moaning about a brand new vehicle with nearly three year old maps seem insignificant. I hope they get their vehicles sorted or changed.
The mini factory in the UK (and I guess others) have a whole department devoted to identifying and curing rattles and vibrations. I think most cars are tested before they ever get to the dealer. This is done not only to keep customers happy and therefore loyal, but also for the good name of the cars and company.
Have Toyota been listening too hard to their own publicity about being the most reliable and fault free?

[krypto Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close krypto]

I think people are getting a bit carried away with out the full facts. Toyota is not the worst by a long shot. I think my Prado is exceptionally quiet for a big 4WD, yes it does have a few vibrations that come with being a heavy duty 4wd.

[Offroader Member Find all posts View Profile Close Offroader]

All of us PP's enjoy our Toyota vehicles and are mostly proud owners, but there is little doubt that since the turn of the millennium, Toyota's quality has declined. This was something acknowledged by the president of Toyota himself in 2003. The cars they built in the 90's were near bullet proof and the company is still riding on this reputation to some extent. To be fair. it is likely that this is an issue facing the entire auto industry with cost cutting and the ever increasing complexity of components. Has Toyota done enough to turn around such problems? Time will tell. Speaking from experience, they could certainly do an awful lot more in improving their customer support and avoiding this "alleged" $60K law suit in the first place.

[brogers Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close brogers]

My previous model prado was excellent, and without undue noise or vibration, but I have seen some folks Prados that weren't as problem free. The issue is then threefold. 1. Quality control and design to ensure that the cars are consistently good. 2. Dealerships and their response to issues and warranty claims (This is clearly variable and dealership dependent) 3. Toyota Motor Company themselves. They seem to be faceless and virtually uncontactable. With many companies, you have outlets for various goods, but you can often contact the actual manufacturer for authoritative advice and guidance. With Toyota, from my experience, if you contact Toyota themselves, you just get referred back to dealerships, who may or may not understand the issue, or have expertise in that area. We have dealt with Subaru, Mazda and Hyundai (with our other cars) and honestly, from our experience anyway, those other companies...particularly Mazda and Hyundai, it was a pleasure dealing with and communication with both the dealer and also the actual parent company...and on more than one occasion I conveyed to those companies that I wish dealing with toyota was as pleasurable and as helpful...honestly. So it would seem that Toyota may need to do some more work in Australia at least, with public relations, and having accessible authoritative vehicle experts that can guide interested owners, and also help support the dealerships. With those other companies we were continually surveyed for our experience with servicing etc, and surveyed about the cars, but that sort of customer feedback, from our experience, has been virtually non-existent with Toyota. We had a great Prado, and hope the next one is equal or better, but I do hope that if it has an issue, the dealership and toyota can work together to help resolve any issue.

Just as an example, (while waiting for delivery of a new Prado) I have already asked the dealership for details on what engine oil to use on the new 2.8 Prado, and so far they have been unable to answer that question. I'm not overly worried at this stage, as I'll read the user manual, and ring oil company technical advisers, but it just goes to show, yet again, that the dealerships are not the experts with the vehicle, and I just wonder if there is a Prado "expert" within the Toyota Motor Company here in Australia.

[ozimacca Member Find all posts View Profile Close ozimacca]

I see it as a change in attitude, I have experienced it before when companies start to be run by accountants without input from the PR dept.

A simple example is in my GXL in the rear door there is a tool kit container, it has the moulded spaces for various tools but the tools are not supplied. It is virtually impossible to buy tools that fit the holes so I have to carry some pliers etc separately.

I already owned pliers so it is not a money thing for me, it is about supplying the simple basic tools that fill the holes which gives the impression of a well sorted vehicle. It would probably cost Toyo $1 to fill those holes but the first impressions of the new owner are very different, instead "gee, a whole tool kit" it is "what a bunch of tight a**es"

It is this penny pinching nit picking that accountants are famous for and will always make a few extra bucks when they start but Always pull the company down in the long run.

[JohnLynn Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close JohnLynn]

Yes I agree with the two posts above, I had noticed tools not supplied but it was not being able to contact anyone higher in the company that has really annoyed me.
In the long term this policy cannot be good for Toyota which is a real shame as overall I am delighted with my new Prado. Why would Toyota make me hesitate to recommend or buy another over my relatively trivial issue of out of date maps?
Has anyone tried to raise an issue above your dealer? Toyota have a "guest experience centre" we used to be called customers but apparently are now "guests" although I feel "mugs" would be more appropriate.
If you ring them you are told to "ask your dealer" in my case the dealer had asked me to ask them as they did not know the answer.
On my subsequent calls to the "guest experience centre" I was put on hold for very long periods. The Americans would do well to use Toyota's music on hold at Guantanamo Bay as water boarding must be a pleasure compared to this.
Anyway it eventually dawned on me that the "guest experience centre" were ringing the dealer. There seems no way for anyone to escalate an issue further.
Now for the possibly controversial bit, I was quickly shouted down when I suggested this on the owners forum. I think that Toyota see the Australian market as a "soft touch".
If you take my issue of out of date maps, this does not happen in the Japanese, American or European markets, you simply register online and download an update.
Also regarding emissions, Europe is using "euro 6" regulations, in the UK for example it has been illegal to sell a new vehicle not complying to euro 6 since September 1st 2015. What engines are fitted in vehicles sold here? you guessed it euro 5 !

[Puddock Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Puddock]

Another example of the lack of available information are the threads on this forum about how various aspects of the vehicle actually work.
e.g. There was a thread on the purpose of device which wastes space in the glove-box. In Australia at least, it seems this thing does nothing more than hold the plastic card of your choice. I suspect Toyota monitors this forum and could easily appoint a body to reply to various posts, if nothing more than to sort out fact from fiction.

[krypto Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close krypto]

Luckily there are a lot of other choices if you are not happy with Toyota. Having to go through the dealer is a double edge sword, I have found the dealer to be very helpful and never had any problem with warranty including some minor issues. On the other hand it is very difficult to go up the chain.

If the biggest problem is some missing tools from a molding or a plastic storage unit in the glove box (which is great for storing the HDD for my in dash nav/entertainment system), then you are doing pretty well. On the other hand if you have a genuine serious issue that Toyota won't fix, such as premature injector failure, then that sucks.

[MidLifeCrisis Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close MidLifeCrisis]

Putting aside "Toyota specific issues". As a first world country we desperately need lemon laws. It is simply too hard for the average consumer to battle Corporate giants in Australia.

We also need a statutory body that will ensure ALL cars imported into Australia are subject to any recall made in another country. So, if Nissan recall for an injector problem in the USA or Norway, the recall is automatic in Australian unless Nissan can show through expert independent advice that it doesn't apply to Australia, and even then, the expert evidence may be rejected by the Australian statutory body and if accepted, the Australian consumer can appeal based upon what they say has happened to their car.

This is more important for Australia now we do not have any local manufacturing from the end of this year.

[ozimacca Member Find all posts View Profile Close ozimacca]

Luckily there are a lot of other choices if you are not happy with Toyota. Having to go through the dealer is a double edge sword, I have found the dealer to be very helpful and never had any problem with warranty including some minor issues. On the other hand it is very difficult to go up the chain.

If the biggest problem is some missing tools from a molding or a plastic storage unit in the glove box (which is great for storing the HDD for my in dash nav/entertainment system), then you are doing pretty well. On the other hand if you have a genuine serious issue that Toyota won't fix, such as premature injector failure, then that sucks.

I agree with you, I said that it was no biggie but it is the attitude of Toyota that is the biggie, people with real problems are ignored and told it is normal.

How can it be normal for an expensive new car to have vibrations when on a smooth road doing a mere 80kph, I don't have the problem (yet) but plenty of people do and they have had to fix it themselves or get the sh**s every time they drive their shiny new car.

The next Biggie will be when all the motors that don't have a restriction plate start blocking up then blowing up. Once we get a lot more EGR motors up around 150-200k towing vans they will be going off regularly.

People who have serviced by the book are going to be very unhappy when they get a bill for $12k for a new motor

[krypto Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close krypto]

Putting aside "Toyota specific issues". As a first world country we desperately need lemon laws. It is simply too hard for the average consumer to battle Corporate giants in Australia.

We also need a statutory body that will ensure ALL cars imported into Australia are subject to any recall made in another country. So, if Nissan recall for an injector problem in the USA or Norway, the recall is automatic in Australian unless Nissan can show through expert independent advice that it doesn't apply to Australia, and even then, the expert evidence may be rejected by the Australian statutory body and if accepted, the Australian consumer can appeal based upon what they say has happened to their car.

This is more important for Australia now we do not have any local manufacturing from the end of this year.

Agree, the system of getting legitimate problems solved is far too hit and miss.

[allanandmichelle Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close allanandmichelle]

Prado vibration

The following report is in Queensland's Sunday Mail today (14/2/16).
I have attempted to reproduce the article word for word....
edit... Obviously that should read "$62,000 Prado buyer"

************************************************** ************************************************** ***********
A Queensland motorist will sue car giant Toyota after it refused to fix or replace a new $62,000 four wheel drive he claims arrived with "terrific vibrations"

Toyota conducted an inspection and acknowledged the fault is "due to engineering of the vehicle and this requires the assistance of TMC Japan"
However, the company has told disgruntled buyer Peter Dewar of the Sunshine Coast, the vibration "does not constitute a major failure and the vehicle is fit for purpose"
Mr Dewar, a dispatch manager, has engaged high profile lawyer Peter Boyce in a bit to recoup his money.
He told The Courier Mail that he test-drove two cars and ordered a Prado GXL 2.8L turbo diesel automatic wagon through Ken Mills Toyota.
"The car I received turned out to be not suitable for driving. It vibrates through a certain rev range, about 1,800rpm, which is when you are at cruising speed. You hear a drone, feel it through the steering wheel and my wife can feel it in the passenger seat. Its terrible"
The 61 year old thought it might be something simple to repair and notified the dealer. He was told to bring the vehicle in to be checked and a staff member drove it., informing him he suspected the problem could be related to the gearbox. However, Mr Dewar said that almost three months had now passed with no action forthcoming from Toyota. A letter from the dealer informed him : "It is the firm opinion of Toyota that the vibration reported does not constitute a major failure." He was offered three free services for the "inconvenience". Mr Dewar was told reports on the vibration had been sent to Japan. A Toyota spokeswoman confirmed that the company was currently investigating the vibration.
************************************************** ************************************************** ***************

Hi
I bought 2012 Prado GXL also for $62000, I drove it out the showroom and felt the vibration, I spoke to the rep and he said to report it on the first service , which I did, I complained every service after that and although they tried to fix it, I have to say the diagnosis every time was worse than that of a child, I was amused at the reasons they gave for the vibration.

The vehicle is now 5 years old and the vibration is so bad, the whole car shakes, it's the same vibration only so bad it's unbearable.

What do I do, I don't have the bottomless pocket to engage a solicitor, and it gets worse, I wish all the people with the same problem would get together and ask Toyota to take a look at the problem seriously, I believe it is a gearbox problem.

I'm interested in other opinions regarding this suggestion
Thanks
Allan

[ozimacca Member Find all posts View Profile Close ozimacca]

If it is the 1500rpm in top gear vibration then try putting into S4, if it stops then it is probably the harmonic vibration in the airbox one.

A lot of people have fixed this by fitting a snorkel, others have put sound deadening in the air box, run a search and you will find a few solutions that have worked.

HTH

[allanandmichelle Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close allanandmichelle]

Prado vibration

If it is the 1500rpm in top gear vibration then try putting into S4, if it stops then it is probably the harmonic vibration in the airbox one.

A lot of people have fixed this by fitting a snorkel, others have put sound deadening in the air box, run a search and you will find a few solutions that have worked.

HTH

Oh no, this is definitely no the air filter box or removed by adding a snorkel, I did this the 1st month I had the car, when they suggested that this may be the problem I was horrified that a vibration as it was, could have been as suggested here, this was a revolutionary vibration, ie a vibration caused by something turning, now 5 years later is is so bad, almost unbearable, I am sure many will have this same problem when the Prado get to around the 130/140 000 km, the question is what to do about it.
Cheers
Allan