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Ironman Foamcell Pros – big bore hydraulics for the Prado IFS

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  • #16
    Hi Mark, I've been reading your threads and learning a lot! There are a couple of things I've been wondering:

    Firstly, there have been some posts where people have seen damage to the top of 120 front strut towers. Could that possibly be caused by using a higher rate spring without a strut that has a corresponding decrease in the compression force? Say, for example, a Kings HD with OEM struts? Or am I completely misunderstanding things?

    Secondly, I'm wondering if you have valving data on the 45682FE with something like a 260-280psi spring? Where would that combo fit on your spring rate vs compression force graph?

    Tim
    2008 D4D GX Auto, OP2 (traction/cruise/climate control), ARB deluxe bar, DominatorX winch, dual batteries, Whitey's 50mm lift, 265/70/17, UHF, King's 7" spotties, trans cooler

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    • #17
      Originally posted by ziggle View Post
      Firstly, there have been some posts where people have seen damage to the top of 120 front strut towers. Could that possibly be caused by using a higher rate spring without a strut that has a corresponding decrease in the compression force? Say, for example, a Kings HD with OEM struts? Or am I completely misunderstanding things?
      From the handful that I have read, damage to the tophat appears to be an install issue - bushes not installed properly, nut not tighten up.
      amts
      Ninja Poster.
      Last edited by amts; 09-06-2017, 07:31 PM.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by ziggle View Post
        Hi Mark, I've been reading your threads and learning a lot! There are a couple of things I've been wondering:

        Firstly, there have been some posts where people have seen damage to the top of 120 front strut towers. Could that possibly be caused by using a higher rate spring without a strut that has a corresponding decrease in the compression force? Say, for example, a Kings HD with OEM struts? Or am I completely misunderstanding things?

        Secondly, I'm wondering if you have valving data on the 45682FE with something like a 260-280psi spring? Where would that combo fit on your spring rate vs compression force graph?

        Tim
        Hey Tim,

        I'm not certain if you mean damage to the actual strut boss itself, or are you referring to the strut itself being bumped out? As amts has said if the top nut is not done tightly enough, you can damage the strut cap bushings and/or damage the shaft by impact on the strut cap itself. Rare, but it does happen because some worry about the bushes being compressed too much.

        Regarding strut bumpouts, this tends to happen on softer coils in combination with soft compression valving.

        The 45682FE is the 80/105 series spec rear shock, and it runs quite high compression valving, around 1600N, which is close to OEM spec compression in the Prado rear. Ironmans recommended coils for the FE are 229lb/in, quite soft, and getting back toward the OEM spec coil rates of the Prado rear, around 200lb/in.

        You have to keep in mind that the 1600N/229lb/in combination works well in an 80/105 series because you can match this combination easily on the front because the Landcruisers run solid axle fronts. Then you can minimise pitch with suspension frequencies being matched.

        When you come to the Prado, it has an IFS front, and runs much stiffer coils at the strut position. After calculating the wheel rates for the IFS motion ratio, this quickly restricts you in terms of keeping the correct front:rear frequency ratio when trying to match the solid rear axle setup. Due to the kinematic limitations of the IFS, this means the majority of kinematic control comes from the rear shocks, and as such it is vital to choose the correct coil rate/valving for the Prado rear. If you don't choose the correct coils/valving for the Prado rear, you'll end up with a pogo stick, particularly in heavy touring vehicles.

        This is what my rear valving is aimed at, ensuring we get the maximum kinematic control of the Prado in off-road situations when you're loaded up to the brim.

        Hope this helps!

        Best

        Mark
        2006 GXL petrol auto. ARB deluxe bar x3 HID IPF's, ARB alloy roofrack, ARB awning, BFG A/T, Safari snorkel, Piranha breathers, Pacemaker extractors, custom Ironman 45710FE 436-569mm with Dobinsons 350, custom Ironman 45682FE 383-618mm with Dobinsons 487, Firestone kevlar 60psi airbags, 30mm extended Roadsafe links, AMTS bashplate and recovery points, ABR Flyer with Powersonic AGM.

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        • #19
          Thanks Mark and amts, that does help!
          Tim
          2008 D4D GX Auto, OP2 (traction/cruise/climate control), ARB deluxe bar, DominatorX winch, dual batteries, Whitey's 50mm lift, 265/70/17, UHF, King's 7" spotties, trans cooler

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