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  • Fitting EGT gauge to 1KD

    I would be pleased to here from members who have fitted an EGT gauge to a D4D 1KD 3.0L diesel Prado (mine is a 2013 ‘Update’ model)

    Background
    I have been advised to fit an EGT gauge by an D4D engine rebuilder to monitor the engine (i.e. should go a long way to help avoid cracked piston issue), as I will next year be towing a caravan at my limit - 2500kg.
    Note: 1. Told not an economic option to install new updated pistons in my engine now to avoid ‘cracked piston’ issue.
    2. I also will be fitting a Transmission cooler, and Firestone Rear air bags with Kevlar sleeve.

    EGT gauge
    I am considering a Redarc EGT gauge (also shows boost pressure, plus optional Temperature gauge if I wish).

    I wish to get someone to install it. I would love feedback on:-
    1. Is it a big job (ie need to pull apart engine to get at exhaust manifold)?
    2. What would be a fair price to install?
    3. Is it possible to install the probe before turbo on D4D? (seems recommended position)
    4. Does Prado D4D exhaust manifold already come with a pre drilled tapped hole for the probe, or does a tapped collar need to be welded on to the manifold for the probe?
    5. Where did you install the gauge?
    6. Recommendations on an Installer (live South East Melbourne area but will travel)
    7. Any issues/concerns/advice?

    Thanks David

  • #2
    Even with an EGT, towing that heavy, on standard 080 or similar pistons.. there's sadly a high probability it will crack no matter what you do to try to stop it.

    Comment


    • #3
      EGT probe and gauge are easy to install. basically more fuel more heat then bang. U shouldnt need to be watching a gauge if tuned correctly the egt temp will hit a certain high point and stay at a safe level

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Piggy View Post
        Even with an EGT, towing that heavy, on standard 080 or similar pistons.. there's sadly a high probability it will crack no matter what you do to try to stop it.
        Thanks for your reply Piggy although it did deflate me a bit.

        I wish to do a number of trips towing my 2500kg caravan to Perth, Darwin and Port Douglas. All from Melbourne so it is long distances at high speeds and at the maximum allowed load. The car will take this, but the engine –the weak link it seems may not. As such I understand why you have said this and it is difficult to argue against your view considering my intentions.

        I love my Prado and have a lot invested in it and do not want to sell it, but I need to reconsider whether the car is suitable for my needs anymore. I am not a fan of diesel overall but there is no suitable petrol choice. (don’t want petrol Nissan Patrol or a diesel Landcruiser 300-both to big, too expensive and not available anyway).

        As such I have been doing a lot of research including speaking with two mechanics with differing views that specialize in Prado’s who have a lot of experience between them (1000’s cars) to determine how bad the problem is, what can be done to prevent, or reduce the engine issue to help with my decision to keep the car or not.

        This is what I have learned and I believe to be the case at this point in time in relation to the D4D 3.0L. engine:-
        1. Toyota acknowledge the problem exists and have published Technical Service Bulletins on the pistons and injectors. They have redesigned the 1KD pistons (4 times?) and also the injectors (seals
        and coatings). Only the latest pistons have been an improvement, which is not
        my car I believe . The injector problems have been fixed but you must monitor them and also at each oil change it is
        wise to check the oil sump pick up for any blockages, which indicates
        faulty seals and will lead to engine failure if not replaced.

        2. Both mechanics believe the problem has affected less than 1% of Prado’s sold to date. It is not a huge wide spread problem but exists. You may have a problem and you may not. In my thread
        ‘Towing 2500kg with a Prado 1KD
        ‘Krypto’ who had towed hard had piston failure yet his mate who has done twice the mileage towing has not.

        3. A new long motor from Toyota will cost you approx. $16,000 A reconditioned motor but with better pistons will be less. (not sure on price -$11,000?)

        4. Some consider the piston, which is not strong enough the cause of the engine failure. Others consider a faulty injection spray pattern the issue (worn injectors) that then causes the pistons to fail.
        Either way both are an issue.


        5. A thread was started on Prado Forum considering starting a ‘class action’ case against Toyota – then petered out. What happened??

        6. Toyota is not the only manufacture that has engine failures either which has been mentioned by tow truck operators to Forum members.


        What I would really like is a V6 petrol, (or V6 diesel as second choice) in a Prado size car at a fair price where the engine is not under as much stress. I understand the advantages of diesel over petrol in relation to towing but they seem to be just too much trouble. Not interested in buying a second hand petrol Prado.

        As you may see I am quite concerned and in a dilemma about what to do after what I have learnt. Both mechanics have suggested to keep the car, one said monitor with a EGT gauge and feel you should be ok. While the other to monitor your injectors.
        I always drive with mechanical sympathy but I realize I am asking a lot of a 4-cylinder engine that is not known for its reliability. I don’t want to end up in the middle of nowhere with a blown engine. In the last day another poster reported towing a 2500kg van (my size) stuck in Mt Isa with a blown engine and I feel for him.

        I am considering my options at the moment:-
        1. Keep Prado- but will need to spend $3000 on - EGT gauge, new timing belt, rear airbags, transmission cooler.

        2. Or sell Prado and buy Isuzu MUX latest model ($63,000). I see this as the only viable choice. I am not a Ute person and not overly enthused on the MUX at this stage.
        Disadvantages:-
        a. it is not constant 4-wheel drive,
        b. new unproven small motor,
        c. only 80L fuel tank (love my 150L tank)
        d. cost to fit out again - tow bar, wiring, Anderson plug, bullbar, CB etc.
        e. the two Isuzu operations and workshops I have seen don’t inspire confidence in me, although a few now around Australia.

        Advantages:-
        a. 3500kg & 350 TBW Towing capacity as van has 2800kg ATM (less in reality) Don’t have to watch my weight as much.
        b. Covered by new 6 year car warranty while travelling. I expect only up to 10 years travelling left due to my age.
        C. New car with much better safety.

        3. Postpone long trips for 1 to 2 years and see what happens with Covid, the new model Prado and the reliability of the new MUX. Expect though that new model Toyota will come with another hefty
        price rise, which I can’t afford or are willing to pay. I would
        love a petrol hybrid Prado but expect it will be a diesel hybrid and with an eye watering price tag.

        Anyway this is where I am at, and I welcome everyone’s thoughts as mine are very confused and torn.

        Thanks
        David

        Comment


        • #5
          Injectors arent as big an issue as some unscrupulous operators would like you to think. That's another issue. But certainly hasn't stopped these dodgy mechanics (Some of them aren't even qualified mechanics) from spreading their tales around the web and building up a following.

          Its been made quite clear that some are doing it for financial gain more than real world issues.

          We have seen way too many Prado D4D's popping, and the problem is becoming more common as time progresses. We personally moved the diesels in the fleet along as its too risky. A 200 cruiser is used for towing heavy now and has nil issues. (and an older 2008-2013 cruiser would also be within your price range.

          Its the risk you take, if you know youre towing heavy, you massively increase the chance of popping the already not fit pistons.

          I did see the Mt Isa one and I'll add an acquaintance who just had his go at Border village on the SA/WA border. attempting to get it put on a truck now.

          Comment


          • #6
            I have a 2010 diesel with a EGT gauge installed and tow around 1300kg fully loaded. Not too heavy. The gauge was about $100 and another $100 to install. Got an exhaust shop to weld a bung just after the turbo. Basically revs are your friend when it comes to engine temps. I sit at 2500rpm on the highway at about 95km and on level ground I don't go over 300 degrees (+ 150 to 200 deg since my probe is mounted after the turbo). On the hills, I have seen up to 400. At the end of the day, there is always a risk of cracking. It sounds like you have done enough research to make a informed decision. If I was going to tow something heavier, I would change vehicles but that's just me. I wouldn't worry about the injectors too much as long as you are getting the readings and they are coming up in spec. Maybe after 10 years or something you might think about changing them. Mine is 11 years old now with original injectors at 130,000km and still well within spec.
            Last edited by kizbot; 19-11-2021, 04:43 PM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Thanks Kizbot for the good information and your thoughts.
              I believe I have done enough research and need to now consider my position. My head and my heart are not agreeing though.
              Thanks
              David

              Comment


              • #8
                It certainly is a hard decision. Another option may be to keep it for another year or two and once the Covid tax comes down buy another vehicle at a decent price.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by kizbot View Post
                  It certainly is a hard decision. Another option may be to keep it for another year or two and once the Covid tax comes down buy another vehicle at a decent price.
                  That is a good option.
                  At the moment you can't get delivery of most brands for 6 to 12 months anyway and you are paying full Retail price, even on accessories.
                  David

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I fitted an EGT gauge to my old KZ. Pre turbo as anything post turbo is a guess as to the temp drop across the turbine.
                    Can drill and tap the manifold in situ, run the engine to blow out any drillings as you go.
                    BUT….
                    it’s not a steam engine, you simply should not have to monitor stuff like this in a modern vehicle.
                    And what happens when your EGT rises, you back off, drop a gear and take two or three times as long to slog up the hill.
                    Chances are your EGT at the top will be same as when you decided to ease off.
                    That was my experience, long gradual pulls like Bonjour Plateau will push EGT way high irrespective of gear selected.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by carco View Post
                      I fitted an EGT gauge to my old KZ. Pre turbo as anything post turbo is a guess as to the temp drop across the turbine.
                      Can drill and tap the manifold in situ, run the engine to blow out any drillings as you go.
                      BUT….
                      it’s not a steam engine, you simply should not have to monitor stuff like this in a modern vehicle.
                      And what happens when your EGT rises, you back off, drop a gear and take two or three times as long to slog up the hill.
                      Chances are your EGT at the top will be same as when you decided to ease off.
                      That was my experience, long gradual pulls like Bonjour Plateau will push EGT way high irrespective of gear selected.
                      Thanks for your reply.

                      What brand of EGT gauge did you install? I am considering a Redarc ($358) which is not cheap.

                      Pardon my ignorance but isn't there a possibility that filings will go through the turbo (bad), regardless if you run the engine while doing so with a view of blowing them out?

                      Thanks David

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I fitted a Delfi multi function knock off. Its screen could be set to display a max of 6- functions. Worked fine but the EGT probe eventually died, too many 700 deg C cook ups.
                        I think turbos are pretty tough, have seen them eat bits of engine without a scratch. Think how many glow plug tips have gone through and the owner is none the wiser until she’s a bit slow at winter starting. Pull the plugs and hello, the tips are missing from some. (Just like the end of my EGT probe)
                        I tried using a vacuum cleaner at first but realised drillings were still escaping. Start her up and 4-cylinder engines really pop from that drill hole.
                        Cast iron doesn’t drill out in long twirleys like mild steel, it chips away.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Interesting information
                          Thanks carco

                          Comment

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