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  • Recovery points

    As always, I am getting things done at the last moment...

    I am looking at installing recovery points for my Kakadu. ARB cost about $375 for one, and I found what looks like a credible an alternative (I think the brand is RoadSafe) for about $220 per pair. My question, is there much of a difference in practical terms between these? ARB seems to be rated for higher load, but my guess is that when using one side the load is transferred to the chassis anyway, so using two rated lower may be a reasonable option?

    Another question - rear recovery points. There doesn't seem to be anything specific for Prado except for tow bars. Is there a stock point that can be safely used as recovery point?

  • #2
    Roadsafe is fine. Use a bridle to spread the load

    Comment


    • #3
      The existing tow points exceed the capacity of a bolt on recovery point. It's a huge scam and actually unsafe. But they aren't as pretty (I've done the calcs, but don't let science get in the way)
      [B]Steve[/B]

      2010 Silver GXL Prado 150, D4D Auto, with a few non standard bits

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by krypto View Post
        The existing tow points exceed the capacity of a bolt on recovery point. It's a huge scam and actually unsafe. But they aren't as pretty (I've done the calcs, but don't let science get in the way)
        Yep, I'm with you. Its not hard to use the existing points safely.

        Comment


        • #5
          Guys, can you explain? Existing recovery points are better than roadsafe?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by ursus View Post
            Guys, can you explain? Existing recovery points are better than roadsafe?
            Krypto nailed it. Existing tie down points are fine, but spread the load by using a quality bridle.

            Pity the OEM points aren't bright orange and scream "expensive offroad accessory".

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Prada View Post

              Krypto nailed it. Existing tie down points are fine, but spread the load by using a quality bridle.

              Pity the OEM points aren't bright orange and scream "expensive offroad accessory".
              The problem is that people call them tie down points, they are tow points.

              Why are the tow points better? Long story, I did a full pots with calculations previously.
              • The bolt on points use mounting on the chassis that hasn't been specifically designed for that purpose.
              • The mounting needs to be a proper friction joint, which never happens.
              • They are prone to bending
              The existing tow points can handle approximately 6-8t static load per side, you'll probably break the chassis before they give way. Show me a single example of them failing.
              [B]Steve[/B]

              2010 Silver GXL Prado 150, D4D Auto, with a few non standard bits

              Comment


              • #8
                Kaon now have recovery points that use both the standard mounting holes and the tow points. So you can have two bob each way, or perhaps belt-and-braces is a better expression to use, but they don't come cheap:

                https://www.kaon.com.au/coming-soon-...it-toyota-prad

                Comment


                • #9
                  I like Kaon's gear, they do prevent the bending that can occur with the other recovery points. However, from an engineering perspective they make zero sense, $480 to achieve what? They do look pretty.
                  [B]Steve[/B]

                  2010 Silver GXL Prado 150, D4D Auto, with a few non standard bits

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The factory points have nothing wrong with them. The steel size and weld is fine, especially when used with a bridle.
                    It’s one thing to look at the engineering of the loops and welds, but its the style and size of the cross member they are attached to that’s the problem. The steel is fairly thin, drops vertically from the chassis about 6 inches and has minimal welding onto the chassis rails.
                    The position of these points at the bottom of the vertical piece of steel provides substantial leverage on the chassis welds.
                    This cross member is only there to support the radiator etc, NOT a decent tug during a recovery.
                    I have recovered of these points in previous prados and have seen some weld cracking. None of these recoveries where particularly harsh.
                    The only advantage of the roadsafe/ arb style points is that they support the cross member by completing the triangle back to the chassis. On a sideways pull, I don’t believe they are a great option, but you shouldn’t be snatching sideways.
                    An arb or dobinsons bullbar actually has a brace that goes back on the angle and stiffens the front points up as well.
                    For the $1000 it costs for an arb set, I bought a winch. For $140 I got a set of roadsafe ones and use a bridle and only moderate straight pulls from the front.
                    I reality I don’t think there is anywhere on the front of a prado that I’d be going crazy on with a snatch strap, but using an aftermarket set that braces back to the chassis rails makes me feel a lot better.
                    In the end if you are interested, strip the front end down and look at it for yourself.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Just to add, there is an old YouTube floating around of a 120 having the above mentioned cross member yanked right off, along with a lot of the front end.
                      We don’t have the full story on how and why this happened, but you would assume it was a snatch recovery and the vehicle looks fairly stock so I’m guessing it wasn’t in any extreme scenario.
                      Some may say that they may have been going stupid etc, but it’s just an example of what I’m trying to say.
                      I theory I’d want the snatch strap to break well before the structure of my vehicle.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Daniel150 View Post
                        Just to add, an old YouTube is floating around of a 120 having the above-mentioned cross member yanked right off, along with a lot of the front end.
                        We don’t have the full story on how and why this happened, but you would assume it was a snatch recovery and the vehicle looks fairly stock so I’m guessing it wasn’t in any extreme scenario.
                        Some may say that they may have been going stupid etc, but it’s just an example of what I’m trying to say.
                        My theory I’d want the snatch strap to break well before the structure of my vehicle.
                        It was Overseas (Saudi Arabia, Dubai, etc). The vehicle was pretty well buried and they yanked the living crap out of it without even bothering to attempt to clear the wheels of sand. Also from what I saw it wasn't a snatch strap, so the forces at play would have been dozens of times over what any vehicle could take.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Daniel150 View Post
                          Just to add, there is an old YouTube floating around of a 120 having the above mentioned cross member yanked right off, along with a lot of the front end.
                          We don’t have the full story on how and why this happened, but you would assume it was a snatch recovery and the vehicle looks fairly stock so I’m guessing it wasn’t in any extreme scenario.
                          Some may say that they may have been going stupid etc, but it’s just an example of what I’m trying to say.
                          I theory I’d want the snatch strap to break well before the structure of my vehicle.
                          I was convinced by Krypto's analysis (in another thread) until I saw that video. It's true that we don't know the full story, but it did demonstrate that it's not just the thickness of the tow points and the welds, but where they are attached to the chassis. And how the recovery is performed. Are recovery points really necessary? Possibly not, if the recovery is done carefully. Are they cheap insurance, compared to a damaged chassis? I think so. The Kaon ones aren't cheap, but if I get at set, that's probably what I'd get.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Just to point out, I made my decision on these points well before I saw that video.
                            I had the front end of my 120 apart and wasn’t convinced of the strength once I saw the bare bones of the chassis. The 150 is more or less the same.
                            The video just cemented my opinion for me that the chassis welds would give in well before the factory loops.
                            Each to their own, it’s your vehicle, you just need to be comfortable with what you choose to do.
                            Piggy, do you have a link to the video that shows the extent of the bogging or what recovery style was used? I’ve only ever seen one of the damage, not the actual bogging or the recovery.
                            That sand looked pretty firm to me.

                            Comment

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