Stats on injector problems with the 1KD-FTV.

[Landuser Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Landuser]

Carbon Lumps from leaky Injector seals

Gidday, I picked the car up Thursday lunchtime after handing over $3900.00 to cover new injectors, glow plugs, fuel lines, associated gaskets plus the inlet manifold clean out so reasonably happy with that.
Inlet system was reasonably clean I was told and really a waste of time and money as it was a prick to do.
After refueling I took the car home and dropped the oil into a clean pan and after letting the oil settle for 30 minutes carefully poured the oil out and inspected for any carbon lumps etc. We found some smallish ( the size of a pin head) and these could be squeezed out in my fingers so really soft" and based on this replaced the filter and the replaced the oil with fresh.
As the aldi special on the inspection camera did not start until today I did not undertake the screen inspection but plan to undertake on TUesday once back in Brisbane.
We left Brissie at 3am Friday and drove to Sydney and plan to drive to Crookwell in the morning then tow a tandem axle car trailer and car back to Sydney on Monday/ Tuesday.
Car runs ok I guess and likely needs the ECU reflashed which may help the performance.
Drove 1006ks and used 108 liters of fuel so economy is the same as before the new injectors. I am looking forward to an improvement after reflash.

G'day Fredrick,

Glad to here you are getting closer to getting on your way.

From what you are describing re cleaner inlet, you may have an engine that has less leak damage,

but just a word of caution, As I have mentioned before, the damaging lumps that block the screen get trapped in the sump floor, or on your oil suction screen face. This is because the drain bung internal to the sump has only a thin skinny slot in it to allow all the Oil to drain, but because it is thin & skinny, it holds the bigger lumps in that do the clogging of the screen. This is a bad design in respect to draining the oil. So it is less likely you will find them in your drained oil, although a rare few might escape in supsension.

From experience, Checking that screen properly is your only guarantee here Fredrick. If Aldi run out of tools, don't worry, I reckon a Mini mag light & a keen eye might get you by.

Regards & good luck

Landuser

[frederick Member Find all posts View Profile Close frederick]

Thanks landuser l will keep you all posted once I check the screen next week.

Cheers and thanks again

Wazza ( Frederick)

[sacred cow Member Find all posts View Profile Close sacred cow]

Re inspecting oil pump screen, I assume that the inspection camera needs to be fed through the sump plug hole. I understand that the camera head on the Aldi inspection camera is 13 mm diameter. I would have thought that this would be too large to fit through the sump plug hole. Can someone confirm the maximum diameter camera that can be used, please?

Glenn

[frederick Member Find all posts View Profile Close frederick]

Hi glen, yes I was going to check the aldi camera before I purchased as i am unsure of the thread bung size as well. It looked to be around 13mm but i did not measure so will need someone with tech expertise to clarify and confirm bung hole size before i buy.

[Landuser Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Landuser]

What your Screen should look like-Not Clogged

Hi glen, yes I was going to check the aldi camera before I purchased as i am unsure of the thread bung size as well. It looked to be around 13mm but i did not measure so will need someone with tech expertise to clarify and confirm bung hole size before i buy.

Hi guys att are pics of a clear screen, what you really need to see!

These were taken with the Inspection tool Toyota techs were using for chasis crack inspection issue

But the camera head did not go right in. So even though it did not go right in you can still get good enough pics like this.



So you should be OK

I hope your Screen does not look like this:

http://www.landcruiserclub.net/forum...p?f=12&t=10505

Good luck guys

Landuser

[frederick Member Find all posts View Profile Close frederick]

Gidday Roo, yes I have the codes written on a bit of paper and will get them entered as soon as I am back in BRisbane on Tuesday.
I am currently in Crookwell NSW and fooooooork it's cold and they say there has been a frost on the last 5 morning so once I collect the trailer and load the car I am out of here heading back to BRisbane.

Cheers

Wazza

[frederick Member Find all posts View Profile Close frederick]

Update, I purchased the aldi camera today so will.check the screen later this week once back in Brisbane.
If one of you ppers want to borrow the camera you are most welcome just pm me.
I am considering adding a flushing oil to the engine just before I drop the oil and check the screen. Any comments or suggestions as to which one I should try.

Regards

Wazza (Frederick)

[sacred cow Member Find all posts View Profile Close sacred cow]

Wazza,

Please let up know if the Aldi inspection camera does the trick.

Thanks
Glenn

[frederick Member Find all posts View Profile Close frederick]

Sure no problems glen.

Cheers

[frederick Member Find all posts View Profile Close frederick]

Gidday Roo, thanks mate for the advice. Geeeez you should off heard the car when I started this morning in Crookwell at - 1 degrees, Christ it sounded like someone had put a hand full of marbles in the rocker cover it was so friggin noisy,, just for a second or two then she was sweet.
I am hopeful after the reflash that noise will disappear. We are staying at Raymond terrace tonight so not quite so cold but will monitor noise in the morning. I have not seen one pp sticker between Brisbane, Sydney, Crookwell, raymon terrace, what is going on?????

Cheers

Wazza (Frederick)

[Landuser Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Landuser]

That link there Landuser, the GSIC link, really is meant for the trade. Oh well, I can see what you are trying to do here and that's to expose Toyota's bad design and their ethics in dealing with the problem which is questionable. I have been doing a bit of digging myself this morning and have discovered that Toyota Corporation has known about this problem for at least six months, the sump problem that is, which is caused by the injector seals. I can say this, because I have the evidence and it looks like Landuser does as well. I hope that Toyota Australia are going to do the right thing when it comes to the sump problem. Unlike the injector problems, and I have to state, that is a general comment because this could turn nasty and ugly in the very near future if they don't handle it right this time around. I don't know how they would get out of this one, they could blame it on the quality of the oil. As long as you have been using CF grade engine oil you should be right. The other maybe the oil filter that you have been using, maybe, we will have to see what they do.
I would like to add something of further interest to do with the sump design. The older designs had a 19mm plug on them where the new stuff has only a 14mm plug. That's a 26% decrease in size and includes the shaft where the thread is as well.
The Roo.

G'day Roo,

Mate, That service link is already freely available online all over the place, thats probably not a bad thing?

In respect to the sump contamination pickup clogging injector leak thing, If Toyota Australia have been aware of the problem this long then all I can say is that I am extremely....extremely disappointed.

But how to deal with it? Make relatively cheap Injector seal changes & Sump screen inspections standard operating proceedure at regular intervals. Then its not really and issue anymore. Sure, you might have to in gratuity deal with prior failures at a customer service level, but you can elimainate future failures from here forward.

and this should not worry Toyota if as they say they are not aware of many failures like this to date? Except mine of course!

Its just really about modifiying service regemes to keep ahead of new technology & designs of common rail diesel systems that are introducing new service issues that are presently being ignored. Hopefully not for long.

Man, I hope fredrick Wazza screen is clear, and that he DOES loose his marbles!

Landuser

[frederick Member Find all posts View Profile Close frederick]

Pleased to report marbles are missing this morning so all good thus far
Cheers

[LargeInAPrado Member Find all posts View Profile Close LargeInAPrado]

how many k's on your vehicle frederick?

[frederick Member Find all posts View Profile Close frederick]

how many k's on your vehicle frederick?

My prado is nov 2006 with 180,000ks on it and d4d of voirse

[sacred cow Member Find all posts View Profile Close sacred cow]

In respect to the sump contamination pickup clogging injector leak thing, If Toyota Australia have been aware of the problem this long then all I can say is that I am extremely....extremely disappointed.

But how to deal with it? Make relatively cheap Injector seal changes & Sump screen inspections standard operating proceedure at regular intervals. Then its not really and issue anymore. Sure, you might have to in gratuity deal with prior failures at a customer service level, but you can elimainate future failures from here forward.

and this should not worry Toyota if as they say they are not aware of many failures like this to date? Except mine of course!

Its just really about modifiying service regemes to keep ahead of new technology & designs of common rail diesel systems that are introducing new service issues that are presently being ignored. Hopefully not for long.


Landuser

Landuser,

Thanks for your excellent contributions to the forum. Re the injector seals, I do not agree though that it is relatively inexpensive to replace them. Someone has said that it costs about $900 - $1000. I have printed out the relevant part of the Workshop Manual and there are 5 pages of diagrams, 14 pages detailing how to remove the injectors and 20 pages of instructions on how to put it all back! It is not a simple procedure and there is scope for significant errors to be made and these could result in high pressure fuel leaks and possibly a fire, air leaks and coolant leaks, etc.

The fuel needs to be drained - surely not both fuel tanks but there is no explanation on what is meant and how the fuel is to be drained. What is required?

In petrol engines, there is usually a procedure to de-pressure the high pressure injector fuel rail before working on it. There is no mention of this. Is this because the diesel engine automatically de-pressurises at shut down? If not, what is the correct procedure?

The coolant needs to be replaced as does the oil filter and quite a few gaskets. Ideally the injector pipes should be replaced. So all up there will a significant cost for parts.

For some unknown reason, the manual describes the injector seals as "nozzle sheets". What do you do if you undertake the arduous process of finally getting to the injectors and the injectors are totally bonded to the housing with carbon build-up? Do you use something like carburettor cleaner/solvent?

Re-installation instruction 2.v has a Hint - "Never reinstall the union bolt on the engine." This seems very strange as 1.m has the instruction - "Tighten the union bolt." The union bolt is not marked as a non-reusable part on the diagram. Any thoughts?

For peace of mind I would like to replace the injector seals but feel the procedure is too complex and it may not be flawless. To me, it is a perfect case of letting sleeping dogs lie unless of course it is definitely known that the the seals are leaking. Then it is of paramount importance that they be replaced without delay. Therefore I would like to have the procedure clearly defined in case I need to implement it at short notice.

So I would appreciate any help possible with refining the procedure. If anyone is doing a replacement in Brisbane, could I come and help you?

Thanks
Glenn