Is the diesel a false economy?

[whiteman Member Find all posts View Profile Close whiteman]

Can anyone see major holes in my thinking? .....

I want to replace my current petrol 120 GXL with another. I need it for up to 4 years. Everyone keeps telling me "go diesel" but when I ask "why?" the answers are not too convincing (I have a degree as an accountant so money is my god). I don't care about engine specs or ability to go through a metre of floodwater. I have driven the diesel and it's good - but so is the petrol.

Fuel cost per annum at 25,000km (costs as per Townsville this morning):
Petrol (13.5l/100km) - 3,375 litres $4,624 @ $1.37/l
Diesel (10.5l/100km) - 2,625 litres $4,121 @ $1.57/l

Service costs - about the same but my diesel mechanic mate with a 120 D4D replaces his oil every 5k cause he says diesel is dirty.

Resale - who really knows but I am happy to factor a 15% lower trade on petrol in 3-4 years - $4,000 difference.

So if I can buy a petrol 120 for $6,000+ less than the eqivalent D4D, am I in front over 4 years? And if I decide to lease the car, the savings are even greater based upon the interest saved.

[D4D Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close D4D]

If you can't buy the diesel for the same price as a petrol there is something wrong with your bargaining skills. The issue between petrol and diesel is the wait for the diesel to be delivered.

[leachy_9 Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close leachy_9]

Resale is not only about the price you will get, but how long it will take to sell. Personally once I've decided to change cars I want to off load the old one ASAP. - Pretty sure I'll have no problems finding a buyer for my D4D. For whatever reason there is greater demand for the D4D.

Leachy

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I have done the sums and I will be going Petrol again I suspect on my next upgrade.

[whiteman Member Find all posts View Profile Close whiteman]

If you can't buy the diesel for the same price as a petrol there is something wrong with your bargaining skills. The issue between petrol and diesel is the wait for the diesel to be delivered.

My bargaining skills are 1st rate. Dealers in NQ have heaps of petrol in stock and are starting to get agrressive with the changeover price. The wait for diesel is quoted at 4 months (and I'll bet reality is a lot longer) so no deals up this way. Supply and demand dictates purchase price.

Is there a Brisbane dealer giving great deals on diesel? I can wait for delivery.

Valid point above on time it takes to sell petrol vs diesel, particularly in 3-4 years time.

[mototrim Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close mototrim]

Re: Is the diesel a false economy?

Diesel (10.5l/100km) - 2,625 litres $4,121 @ $1.57/l

I don't know where you got that figure as Toyota quote 9.3l/100kms and i personnely achieve this all the time and sometimes better.

I also agree with Leachy given the press and talk about the D4D would probably take longer to sell the petrol.

My personnel reason for the diesel is the extra kms gained out of the same tank (approx 300kms) which is only of benefit if your traveling long distances between remote towns.

For a example i recently did the Holland Track in W.A and did 1300 kms round trip towing my fully loaded camper and made it back to Perth where i saved a considerable amount,if i had to of filled up out of town.

[Matt Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Matt]

petrols sell just as easily as diesels in the second hand market..

ill go petrol again if i upgrade, unless i start doing more kms then i may consider the diesel.

Since sept 04 ive only done 42000kms in the prado.

[whiteman Member Find all posts View Profile Close whiteman]

10.5 comes straight from my mate with the D4D after 6 months use similar to me. My 13.5 is a high average for me. I'm more likely to average less than 13 but I want to be conservative.

[Tonytbts Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Tonytbts]

Resale is not only about the price you will get, but how long it will take to sell.

Given that Whiteman specifically contemplated the lower trade-in value, I do not think he will have to wait to rid himself of the Petrol Prado...

I am a long way from an expert, and am probably biased towards the perol in any event, but I could not find any gains to be had by spending extra on the D4D.

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Please place your location in your profile tony.

[lofty Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close lofty]

Thanks for your post whiteman, i had exactly the same thought this morning when i saw petrol for $1.42 (at the bottom of the discount cycle) and at the same petrol station diesel was $1.71 :shock: Diesel is NEVER discounted :evil:

Give me a break :!: :!: 30 cents per litre difference thats $54 per fill. :evil:

I'm thinking that if the price disparity is the same when we upgrade i will be going for a petrol.

Our reasons for going diesel with our current car are obsolete with this pricing.
1) better fuel economy meaning greater range and less filling at remote locations (even with your conservative figures of 13.5l/100km that gets you nearly 1400 km)
2) ability to buy diesel on any outback property or town (never been to a property that doesn't have a motor bike therefore petrol, plus you would be pretty dumb to travel 1400km then start thinking about filling up)
3) better towing (reading this forum over the last few months has blown that one)
etc

For a car that does at least 80 percent of its driving in the city i will be going petrol 4 sure.

You would have to do a hell of a lot of outback driving to make the extra purchase price and fuel costs worth while IMHO

Also, i wouldn't be surprised if petrol became a more popular trade in than diesel at some point in the future.

My 2c

[Bear Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Bear]

G'day Whiteman,
Your reasoning sounds good. With a background in economics/finance, I could not separate the diesel/petrol on the basis of cost benefit analysis alone. Finally opted for the petrol, a) quieter, b) smoother round town, c) cheaper up-front (although i bought a used 05 in 07). Another factor i considered, but was not a deal maker or breaker, was the faint possibility of converting to gas.

If i was buying again i think i would drive both and purchase on non-financial considerations. The diesel would have to drive a lot better to warrant the extra 6k ... IMHO. Yep! The more i think on it, the better the petrol sounds!

Let's face it, even if we get it wrong and in 4 years the diesel is worth 10 grand more than petrol, the difference is only 1k per year (having paid 6 grand less up front ... wonder if you might even do better, have you read the thread http://www.pradopoint.com/viewtopic.php?t=3075 ) and, after factoring back in the interest saving of (say) 550 per year and the tax benefit of (say) 1k at trade in time, the difference in overall cost seems, IMO, to be insignificant.

Do please keep us up to date on your reasoning, and ultimate decision, i think many of us could benefit from some informed input.

[Signature035 Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close Signature035]

Can I add my completeley irrational thoughts............I love the way a diesel starts, I love the smell, I love the sound........unless you have owned one, its a hard thing to relate to... (do I have a problem?) ops:

Oh.....and the touque when towing & the distance between refueling when travelling are not bad either

[mardo Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close mardo]

A couple of points in favour of the diesel,

1. As diesel vehicle sales increase over time, discounting at the servo will start and eventually match unleaded. A good peak in the future is Europe. They've had high fuel cost for a lot longer than here in Oz and diesel is actually cheaper, remembering that diesel vehicles account for about half of total sales. I believe we will get close to that.

2. As petrol reaches then exceeds the $2.00 barrier, no one will want to touch a petrol 4WD. Unfortunately, I predict that their resale value will plummet like the proverbial down the toilet. It all about perception from the public "petrol guzzling 4WD versus High efficient diesel 4WD"

my 2c worth

cheers
mardo

[ChrisD Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close ChrisD]

Can I add my completeley irrational thoughts............I love the way a diesel starts, I love the smell, I love the sound........unless you have owned one, its a hard thing to relate to... (do I have a problem?) ops:

I'm exactly the opposite, I've always had performance cars & the Prado is the first 4x4 I've had, I bought a petrol as I don't give 2 shits about fuel economy & absolutely loathe the sound of a diesel (yes I did test drive one though). Driving around all day listening to what sounds like a tractor chugging around would send me nuts.

Funny how we're all different :lol: