Cost of Traction Control Option Vs Diff Lockers

[xvprado Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close xvprado]

Must admit, I have experienced no real adverse affects of TC on sand

TC will engage if one wheel is rotating at a different speed to its partnered wheel, more often than not both wheels are spinning equally, TC doesnt even know it, is my assumption, therefore doesnt intefere

The other important element of sand driving is to ensure that CDL is engaged to get the power distribution right, therefore encouraging TC to stay in bed quietly

[Matt Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Matt]

true xv.. i must admit, i think the failures i have seen were produced by not having the cdl locked.

still tho.. brakes and sand dont mix..

horsepower is the greatest asset in sand.. over tyres and even 4wd..

i have seen a v8 SWB MQ patrol go up sand tracks in 2wd that even the most capable (stock) 4wd had troubles with.

petrols are usually more suited to sand as well.. because of thier power distrubution and ability to rev.

[mototrim Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close mototrim]

I had a pootrol some years back with front and rear diff locks and did notice a definate benefit in sand especially on straight beach runs.When engaged the car seemed to lift and feel very light on the sand.
When i required to turn simply disengage the front diff lock and carry on.
One thing i remember being told to me before i bought them was when you get stuck with twin diff locks your really stuck. They are definatley a great piece of gear but can make you become over confident as i found out on a couple of occasions.
I am looking forward to justo showing me how to use the TC when the grande comes

[Russ WA Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Russ WA]

blackbird64
Go the GXL
Get a ARB bull bar as they are better for approach angles and look better.

I have blown the rear diff and it cost alot($3000 plus wheel bearings) :cry: to change to a rear locker once the damage is done. They need to repair the old one first.
If you do the Tyres and suspension from new brand new I believe some tyre companies give you some money back for your new Grand treks.
Or you Just wait until it gets about 40 000km on it and replace them with 5 new tyres( Coopers )
Just my thoughts

Russ

[matty Member Find all posts View Profile Close matty]

Just thought i would share my latest experience, went to use my front locker, no go, apparently ARB are telling me the front carrier bearings have failed? at 20K ??, at the moment their in talks with toyota re: warranty. i will post the full story in driveline section.

[wally Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close wally]

Food for thought... I have been told by a reliable source that 95% of rear diff failures seen by ARB have been Prados with traction control fitted.

After the diff carrier breaks fit an ARB locker to cure the problem as the ARB carrier is much stronger.

Apparently rear diff failures in Prados without traction control is very rare but there have been some, these do a lot of hard off-road work.

Roughly $6000 for Traction Control option I'm told but you get a few other items.

My choice don't bother with Traction Control if it's going to see medium to hard off-road duties.

[Addy Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Addy]

I would have to agree with TP as 95% of prados getting lockers would be GXL's anyway. If anything the ones that go bang are prados without traction control as the diff works harder, more speed needed one wheel lifts of the ground spinning in the air and then touches the ground again and bang.

[Chuck Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close Chuck]

You need to look at these.
http://www.pradopoint.com/viewtopic....highlight=diff
http://www.pradopoint.com/viewtopic....highlight=diff

Remember search is your friend. 8)

[Justo Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close Justo]

I do have to ask this question...!! Has anyone heard of a diff blown on a 120 fitted with traction control.? I'm not saying it hasn't happened but I'm yet to hear of one..!
Seems its a case of the guys that have traction love it and those that don't have it hate it.. wonder why that is..? :lol:

[plucker Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close plucker]

In sand the most important thing is pressure. I was bogged in the ol lux up to the diffs and going nowhere. Reduced the pressure and drove over the hole and up the sand dune. It was a diesel 2.8.
For a couple of hundred bucks, the best investment is an air compressor, and forget the worry of locks etc unless you are serious into mud and rocks.

[wally Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close wally]

[quote="Team Piggy"]I think ARB are spinning some crap there!! :lol: Why would they be looking at them anyway when most would be covered by Toyota warranty?

Where exactly did I say ARB are looking at them as warranty??? As usual jumping to conclusions porky. Maybe it should have read 95% of diffs that have lockers fitted after breakage are fitted with TC.

The scenario is a back and forth rocking motion when a TC fitted truck loses traction e.g. on a rocky shale surface and one wheel is light (almost off the ground) and the opposite wheel has a full load on it TC is applied to the light wheel, as you rock forward and back the crown will flex and can break in the split second TC is applied and disengaged from one side to the other.. A non TC truck would just have a wheel in the air spinning going no place.

Ask your mate at Toyota about it. Then ask you mate how often ARB are called out to Toyota for a diagnosis and possible resolution.

If your mate doesn't know about it, then please let us know where he works so we can all avoid that Dealer.

[Justo Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close Justo]

Have to say it sounds odd Wally. I'm not having a go at you and I'm not saying it hasn't happened on TC vehicles. But every case on here (pradopoint) and every incident I've heard of has been on a non TC GX or GXL and I do believe until very recently the TC wasn't an option on either of these. It does sound like someone has given you some misleading info.

I doubt Toyota hears about all these diff issues either, I have a mate that's a mechanic and has heard from the diff repairer he uses that the LSD rear is a common problem on the 120.
And just to point out the TC vehicles don't have LSD, they run an open diff.
If you said 95% are on non TC vehicles.. then we would all believe you. :wink:

[wally Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close wally]

Hi Justo, No offence taken.

I'd like to know how many km's the LSD fitted trucks have on the clock when the breakage occurred and what exactly they were doing at the time and if they were modded.

It's a well publicised fact that a Toyota LSD's are next to useless and after 30,000kms are more or less open diffs by this stage anyway.

The most common cause of diffs breaking is by fitting larger and aggressive tyres, at a guess (yes a guess team porker before you have to but your pound of bacon in) I'd say the majority of modded Prados will be Standard, GX and GXL as the buyers of these have bought them to use offroad.

Also anyone know how many VX and Grande are sold and taken offroad compared to the the STD, GX and GXL models?

[Russ WA Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Russ WA]

Wally,
I would guess to think most of the top of the range cars with traction control would not be used for off road work or modified as much as the standard and poverty pack ones.

As the 120 series gets older and the price falls these cars will be taken out for a good thrashing.

Prados are built with luxury in mind at the top end. Most of them will only see a gravel road or two on the way to a property out side the metro area.
There are some exemptions thou.

Now the standard cars are different.
For a lot less you can have a fully modified Prado ready to take on just about and terain.
Breakages happen when components are pushed to the limit and the rear diff of a Prado doesn’t take much to take it to that limit.(I Know).

Being an open diff on the traction controlled models it has less chance of shock loading the crown wheel as opposed to the weak LSD on the GXL or GX model.

So yes you would be right in saying that most of the breakages are caused by people who actually use there car for what it is designed for. Off road use.

Just my 2cents worth.
Russ