The Diesel Economy: I just don't get it.

[declanday Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close declanday]

Hey all,

I've been agonising over vehicle choice over the last few months; I'm deciding between a 120 Prado, Disco 3 and a Pajero (but leaning towards the Prado hence why I'm here). I've found this forum invaluable for finding out as much information as I can, but something has been bugging me an I hope you can shed some light.

Like most people, I have been thinking about the decision of petrol vs diesel. There are many threads on here about this, but they all seem to focus on purchase cost vs fuel consumption. In this respect, the diesel wins out. However, I have read enough of big diesel repair bills for fuel contamination and replacing injectors to think that the long term costs of owning a diesel surely can't be less than a petrol? No one seems to discuss these big repair bills in the running cost discussions; why is this?
I understand that fuel contamination isn't a common problem, but the risk is there, especially when doing a lot of travel around the country (and there are still other big cost items outside of dirty fuel).

I don't really have any preference between either, and I don't intend for this to be another diesel vs petrol thing; I'm just confused as to why diesel is always considered the cheaper option when repair bills appear to be so much higher.

Cheers.

[krypto Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close krypto]

Long story short;
1. The injectors are a wear item and should be replace every 120-150k, you can get longer out of them but you might be unlucky
2. Fuel contamination shouldn't be a problem in cities. It is a potential problem due to the extremely high tolerances on direct injection systems. Simple preventative measure if it is a concern for you is to fit an additional filter/water catching system. Cheap and simple solution.

The petrol is lower maintenance but also remember that there are millions of diesels running fine that you don't hear about on forums.

For towing, which is why I own one, the diesel is a great choice and the Prado even more so because of the long range tanks. When we go camping for two weeks I can get to where I'm going and drive around without having to worry about fuel.

[mjrandom Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close mjrandom]

Diesel is not just about economy when towing or otherwise it is about the torque and how and when it is delivered. Couple the D4D with an automatic and you get bags of torque just off idle. Makes for more relaxed 4wding even in sand. I was a V6 petrol owner in a different brand of sausages and beach climbs were always done at mach 3 with lots of right foot and hang on tight. With modern diesels that is unnecessary and if anything I get criticised for driving too slowly. The fridge stays bolted to the floor, drink bottles stay in the holders etc.

[GEEEXL Member Find all posts View Profile Close GEEEXL]

then you have resale to consider as well

depreciation on petrol version's considerably higher than diesel powered prado/landcruiser/hilux

[Spilsy Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Spilsy]

On top of all the other valid points above, for me it was partially about the sound of a diesel motor...I like it!!
The day I picked up my Prado, it was parked in a Garage at the dealer (reserved for the more expensive cars as the corollas and camrys were parked outside in a lot) and when I first started it up, the garage sort of hummed and rattled and vibrated (well in my mind anyway) and made me giggle inside.

[Bushbasher Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Bushbasher]

I first started it up, the garage sort of hummed and rattled and vibrated (well in my mind anyway) and made me giggle inside.

Flash-backs to when your grandad took you for a ride on his Chamberlain tractor no doubt.

[Spilsy Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Spilsy]

Flash-backs to when your grandad took you for a ride on his Chamberlain tractor no doubt.

Showing my lack of age here, but I'm not sure they were a prominent brand when I was younger, in fact google informs me they ceased manufacture 4 years before my birth. I think my grandfather had a Massey Ferguson anyways - and that was well before my existence.

[mjrandom Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close mjrandom]

Chamberlains were just John Deeres in funny clothes. I drove one before I had my licence and it was well past its useby date. King pin bushes were non existent and the thing probably did 30 kph. Just a wee bit scary.

[declanday Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close declanday]

Thanks for the replies everyone.

I do think overall the diesel is the best choice (that range is so appealing), but I can't help but be worried that a $10k bill is going to happen someway down the line and wipe out all the fuel savings, especially as the V6 doesn't seem that thirsty.
Am I overblowing the chances of a big $$ repairs in the diesel?

[Fred63 Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close Fred63]

i always had petrol prior to the Prado
Having had it for about 18 months i doubt i would go back to petrol in a $WD

[r4ndll Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close r4ndll]

Thanks for the replies everyone.

I do think overall the diesel is the best choice (that range is so appealing), but I can't help but be worried that a $10k bill is going to happen someway down the line and wipe out all the fuel savings, especially as the V6 doesn't seem that thirsty.
Am I overblowing the chances of a big $$ repairs in the diesel?

Keep an eye on it, and keep up your maintenance and unless you are unlucky you shouldn't have a big bill. I had my injectors replaced at 100,000km for around $2k. (If you get the non D4D diesel 120, the injector costs are much less - so factor in $2k every 100-120,000km)
You can get big unexpected bills in any car. Prior to the Prado I had a similar aged petrol x-trail that needed both front bearings replaced and went through 2 clutches in 7 years at $1800 a time

Tow or do lots of low range work in the V6 and then revisit "V6 doesn't seem that thirsty" .. If you don't do either then you are probably right.

then there's the qualitative stuff - I love the sound of my diesel especially with the snorkel and the window down - wish I had the V8 diesel and a 4" exhaust though

[Spilsy Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Spilsy]

The big bill is a "might happen, but probably wont" type thing.
As with anything, proper preventative maintenance and a little care should prevent any issues - except replacing your injectors...that's going to have to happen ($$$$ per injector???, and a little less if you buy some refurbished ones, which I am informed are pretty good if they've been done properly)

[Justinvv Member Find all posts View Profile Close Justinvv]

Chamberlains were just John Deeres in funny clothes. I drove one before I had my licence and it was well past its useby date. King pin bushes were non existent and the thing probably did 30 kph. Just a wee bit scary.

Only the later ones, the early ones where Built in Australia and were Chamberlains.

[AJ120 Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close AJ120]

Often not mentioned as well is the problem with the V6 engine mounts falling through the chassis, yes its not common, but given how few Petrols are sold compared to Diesels your chances of this happening on a per vehicle basis "might" not be that much different, and this can lead to the vehicle being written off and Insurance may not cover it.

Also take what you read on the internet with a grain of salt, not everyone that had a motor go bang had it happen unexpectedly and out of the blue with no warning or fault of there own, I know for a fact that some people conveniently leave out some very critical information when they talk about their engines blowing up.

Cheers Andrew

[Beach Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close Beach]

You have asked the right question. I went through the same process and ended up with a V6 120.

"Buy a diesel and you will always be financially in front", simply isn't true.

Loaded up, touring and towing you would lean towards a diesel. Diesel fuel isn't always cheaper so don't expect automatic massive savings there. Also servicing costs have to be taken into consideration. I drive a 150 diesel at work that spends its life loaded up and it drinks like a fish. Go figure.

Having said that, I've met people that have toured and towed with a V6 and are not real fussed by the fuel bills and reckon its not that bad.

I personally know two people that have been through the dreaded diesel engine rebuild. Not pretty.

Like with anything, it comes down to usage, personal preference and what will best suit you.