Check engine and VSC warning lights after refueling

[Magno Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close Magno]

I've owned my '07 LC 120 D4D for exactly 1 month today, and am really pleased with it, except for one irritating thing.

About 50-100kms after refueling, the check engine, VSC TRC and VSC OFF warning lights come on.
This has happened 3 times so far (i.e. after every time I have refueled).

I have reset the lights (disconnect the batteries), and the problem is gone, until the next time I refuel.
This could, of course, be unrelated to refueling, but the odds are quite low, in my opinion.

I read somewhere that this could be caused by the fuel cap not being tightened enough, but believe me, I've tried tightening it as much as it can be tightened, but the lights still come on after a while.

Any ideas?
Thanks!

[Pragueprado Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Pragueprado]

I had that problem when my alternator was on its last legs, and also when the MAF sensor needed cleaning; it could just be a coincidence that the lights go on after refueling. If you have the ability to test the alternator, try that. And if you haven't cleaned the MAF sensor in a while, it won't hurt to try that.

[Magno Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close Magno]

Thanks PraguePrado. I haven't cleaned the MAF, nor tested the alternator. I'm still convinced that this is a fuel pressure/system issue.

Last time I filled up (full tank), sure enough, the check engine and other warning lights came on. This time I decided to leave them on (i.e. not disconnect the battery and all that hassle). After a few days, when the fuel level had decreased to about 50%, the lights went off! (They came on again the next day, possibly after heavy braking).

I'm just throwing this one out there, and hoping that someone bites (i.e recognizes the problem, symptoms):
I have little or no knowledge of the inner workings of the D4D engine, but from the almighty Internet I gather that the fuel system is pressurized, and also that there's a charcoal canister somewhere along the lines. Consider that the check engine light comes on if the fuel pump isn't able to build up enough fuel pressure. And if the tank is full (or near full), then the fuel pump would struggle to build pressure if the fuel cap or charcoal canister is clogged/faulty.

My reasoning is: if the fuel cap is clogged, and the fuel pump is trying to suck fuel to the engine, then it will struggle, since the tank is full of fuel (and a liquid cannot be compressed, if my high school physics serves me right ). If, however, the tank is half full, then there's plenty of air in the tank, which can easily be compressed (well, expanded, in this case).

So my current leads are faulty/clogged fuel cap (unlikely IMO) or a faulty/clogged charcoal canister (someone please explain to me what this canister does, where it is (other than "it's in your engine bay") and if it may affect the fuel system). Am I barking up a non-existent tree here?

By the way, the car runs fine with the warning lights on, which leads me to believe that this isn't a serious error. It just bugs the hell out of me

[LeighW Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close LeighW]

Honestly I fail to see what Vehicle stability control and Traction control warnings have
to do with how much fuel you have on board.

I would suggest you get an ODB scanner and read the ECU to find what error codes
codes are being stored?

Cheers
Leigh

[Guest Close Guest]

I may be wrong but I have only seen charcoal canisters on the V6 petrols only.

[MickL Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close MickL]

So my current leads are faulty/clogged fuel cap (unlikely IMO) or a faulty/clogged charcoal canister (someone please explain to me what this canister does, where it is (other than "it's in your engine bay") and if it may affect the fuel system). Am I barking up a non-existent tree here?

Charcoal canister is only on petrol models, it absorbs fuel vapour from the tank and stores them until they can be added to intake of the running engine to be burnt off. (Part of the emission control system)

I'd suggest you have an intermittent fault in a wheel ABS sensor or cable as your most likely culprit. You can visually inspect the wheel wiring, plugs and sensors for any physical damage for a start, But as Leigh said it would be helpful to access a scan tool to narrow it down to which wheel.

Mick

[SWR Banned Find all posts View Profile Close SWR]

Gday Magno

I have a few theory's!

#1 normally i would say Check that your weight distribution valve is set correctly! ...

This normally sits over your rear axle and controls the brake distribution when extra weight is added to the vehicle but you have ABS etc so i believe you "do not" have a "weight distribution valve"!

EG: Normal with no extra weight the braking is usually 70% front brake and 30% rear!... This makes the front brakes do all the pulling up without the rear brakes locking. As extra weight is added to the vehicle the rear brakes can take more braking force without rear wheels locking due to extra weight on the back axle and discourages front brakes from locking but you have ABS etc with haul sensors on all 4 x wheels that detect wheel lock so no load sensing valve is needed!

NOTE: All vehicles with none ABS braking are supposed to re-set this valve when fitting a suspension lift kit to there vehicles!

#1 I would make sure that none of your brake callipers are not seized or binding badly!

#2 No odd size tyre or low tyre pressure!

#3 Brakes bled properly and obviously if error codes are checked an error code would dob-in (Identify) a faulty haul sensor (ABS wheel sensor)..

As far as charcoal canister goes the diesels don't have one!... What they do have is a breather valve that sits directly over the rear axle which stops the fuel tank from creating negative vacuum and not positive pressure! (Hence the suction noise when removing the fuel cap and not a blowing pressure!).

I have seen petrol tanks get sucked in when charcoal canisters (Petrol vehicles only) have failed to purge negative pressures!

Here is two links below on how to locate and check that the fuel tank breather (Diesel's only) is not blocked!

Fuel tank breather maybe????

And this one!

Fuel Tank Breather

Cheers

[Magno Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close Magno]

Thank you all for your comments and suggestions!

I'll definitely be checking the breather valve. Seems like it's a good (and simple) thing to do regularly anyway.
And also I'm going to borrow a friend's OBD scanner over the holidays, to find out (hopefully) what's wrong.

Will keep you posted!

[Magno Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close Magno]

Ok, I've got the OBD scanner, but where's the OBD port? I figured it would be in the driver's side fuse box, but no

Yes, I could probably search PP for the answer, but I want to pull the fault codes NOW

Thanks in advance...

[cfryback Find all posts View Profile Close cfryback]

Seeing as your is a left hand drive, the OBD port should be located under the driver's side (where interior fuses are) just on the outside of the kick panel. It may or may not have a cover on it.

Have a look here - http://codes.rennacs.com/photo-galle...-21-Photos.php

Even though these are pictures of a right hand drive, it does give you a better idea of where it is .

[Magno Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close Magno]

Alright, I pulled the codes and got back P0400, which apparently means:

P0400 - EGR position sensor (valve out of position)

I'll need to research this, but does anyone have any quick tips/tricks/fixes for this?
And perhaps a picture/explanation of where the EGR valve is located?

Thanks all

[cfryback Find all posts View Profile Close cfryback]

Ahh....I had this just after my rebuild.

It is a small electric valve towards the firewall. Will not over affect running of engine. Odd how yours comes and goes though, I'd be suspicious of it though.

Anyways a diagram picture (Item#89455A) -> http://www.neoriginal.ru/cat/toyota/...HRPSY/4_8405_3

You can get them much cheaper online than via Toyota -> http://www.amayama.com/search/?q=89455-35020

[psychoaussie Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close psychoaussie]

Hi guys. Today I came across the same problem with my 07 D-4-D Prado. I was driving home and noticed my VSC/TRC, VSC OFF and Engine lights were all on.

First thing I did was crapped myself and secondly drove to Maitland Toyota (luckily only 5km's away) from were I was working.

1/ Maitland Toyota -The Tech plugged the laptop to the car and bought up the error codes. Faulty/damaged Injectors! Showed me the parameters they were running and No1 & 4 were at -.05 & +.04 (apparently this is not good). 2 & 3 were about +.02 (OK)

Anyway he said to have injectors replaced it will cost approx.. 4K - 5K Includes removing and cleaning both fuel tanks.

2/ Wyong Toyota - So I get home and ring these guys for another opinion. Tell them that the codes said faulty injectors. They quoted similar price as Maitland but didn't know about needing to remove/clean fuel tanks. Said to add $130 per tank if I wanted them cleaned out.

3/ Gosford Toyota (3rd opinion) Spoke to the head Technician on phone (Dave) He said it is hard to tell problem until they do a thorough check which will cost me $500 approx. to diagnose.(That's just to diagnose problem)
He then goes on to tell me they need to do compression testing etc. (fair enough)
Dave (Head Technician) said it could be many things.
a) Bad compression, rings etc. (up to $7500) repair.
b) Needs new injectors ($2730 Injectors)
He mentioned when they do injectors it is there policy to also replace the rail and injection pump. (Does this sound right or is it necessary)?

So my diesel does have the cold start rattle and disappears at running temp. Injectors are most likely screwed.

Anyone had anything similar with the codes and what recommendations are there please.

I know nothing about diesel engines and have read many sections of the forums with all the different answers/recommendations. Would appreciate any reply with solid info to give me some guidance or fix/costings parts etc.

Regards
Dave.....

[mjrandom Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close mjrandom]

There are a couple of things to check:

Is the engine running roughly particulary just on start up and is it really noisy like someone left some spanners in the cylinders? Is the car using lots more fuel and blowing white/grey smoke?

First thing is to read the injector codes cold. A dealer or a mechanic with the appropriate tool can read this, there may even be someone near you on PP who has the software on a computer. From memory the problem is when the codes are + or - 3.0 or more so the readings they gave you don't make sense. There are threads on here (looooong ones) that talk about the injectors.

http://www.pradopoint.com/showthread...e-in-D4D-Prado

Second but probably more important is to check if the oil pump suction strainer is clogged, a blocked screen can (will) destroy your engine. You need to drop the oil out of the sump and look with a camera preferably or a mirror. This is caused by the injector seals leaking and hot combustion gases cooking the engine oil into lumpy bits (technical term) which then fall into the sump. The lumpy bits dont pass through the strainer and block it eventually.

You don't mention how many km on the odometer nor what month the month of manufacture is but injectors in an 07 were typically ones to fail unless you have a Dec 07 build and even then there are no guarantees.

Injectors can be replaced fairly easily and cost of parts varies depending on whether you use genuine Toyota from Oz (crazy money), genuine thorugh RickNZ (very reasonable pricing), new Denso (similar to RickNZ, same part as OEM just from the manufacturer rather than Toyota) or reconditioned injectors from Bailerys (again very reasonable). Have a read here:

http://www.pradopoint.com/showthread...jector-pricing

If there has been damage done to the engine either by the injector causing ignition problems and splitting/cracking a piston or you have a problem caused by poor oil circulation you can be up for a short motor which is expensive. Again this is covered in the first thread I linked to.

Hopefully it isn't bad but don't wait around and get those two things checked asap.

EDIT: Just to let you know I had a Nov 07 D4D and had two injectors out of range. I had no symptoms and no warning lights but I caught it by getting the injector feedback values checked at the 130k service. Luckily I had Extracare extended warranty which paid for the new injectors and pipes etc. No damage to the engine and the sump screen was clear. Cost to Toyota was $3k including parts (Denso injectors and consumables) and labour.