diesel rattle in D4D Prado

[SWR Banned Find all posts View Profile Close SWR]

Hi Skywalkerrun,

Got a question for you.

Is the No. 1 injector the work horse, does the energy from No.1 propel No.2,3 &4 to do their thing.?

Gday Graceilyons64

Answer: "Sorta of yes but in a nutshell "NO!" .... lol ... I will try and keep it simple as to not confuse as No:1 is only part of the full firing cycle for all of the 4 x cylinders.

Theory in my head is allot easier to construct as appose to correlating it into words that can be understood in a simple manner?

REASON: There is 2 x full crankshaft revolutions to one firing cycle!.. By the time the crankshaft has done 2 x full crank revaluations (720 Deg) all 4 x cylinders would have fired!.. With this in mined, if the engine stops on No:4 cylinder, when you turn the ignition key back on it will carry on the firing cycle from where it initially stopped! That is why there is a cam shaft and crank angle sensor! So that the ECU (Electronic Control Unit) knows exactly what and which cylinder Intake/Exhaust valves are open/closed and where exactly the pistons are siting in the cylinder bore!

EG:1 by the time the crank shaft has done 2 x full revolutions (720 Deg) all 4 x cylinders will have fired simultaneously! ... firing order 1-3-4-2!

I will concentrate on the full firing cycle of "ONE" cylinder only then imagine all four cylinders firing consecutively 1-3-4-2 within two full crank revolutions.

EG:2 Induction = downward stroke/ combustion = upward stroke (360 deg)/ Power = downward stroke/ Exhaust = upward stroke!.. (720 deg) Better to simplify as suck/ Squeeze/ Bang/ Blow!

No gutter talk at this point please guys!.. Lol

EG:3 In one full crank revolution (360 Deg) the piston has traveled from the top of the cylinder bore (TDC = Top Dead Center) to the bottom (BDC = Bottom Dead Center) and then back to the top of the cyder (TDC). This one cycle (360 deg) accounts for "Induction, combustion" (Suck/ Squeeze).

The next crankshaft rotation (360 Deg) will be again from the piston traveling from the top of the cylinder again then to the bottom then back up to TDC again!.. Only this time it will be the finishing the complete firing cycle. "Power = Downward stroke/ Exhaust = Upward stroke" (Bang/ Blow)...

RECAP:

#1 Induction (suck) (inlet valve opens), By the time the piston reaches the bottom of the cylinder the inlet valve is closed.

#2 Combustion (squeeze) (All valves are closed). piston travels to the top of the cylinder compressing fuel/air mixture.

#3 Power (bang) (Fuel/ air has been ignited pushing the piston back to the bottom of the cylinder) All valves still closed on the power stroke.

#4 Exhaust (blow) (As the piston returns back up the cylinder the exhaust valve is opened and gases are pushed out the exhaust to drive the turbo!

I did not include valve overlap etc as kept it to the simple explanation!

As you can imagine it is much more complex than i have described but you get the picture!... I hope!... Lol

No. 1 seems to be the one to malfunction first. In my case Toyota Australia identified No. 3 injector failed.... Causing huge damage.

As iv'e mentioned in other threads further back on this thread that i believe as "a" cylinder fails (Looses power for what-ever reason) the ECU tries to compensate by putting more load on the next in line firing cylinder... I assume the ECU was making No:3 work harder in-order to carry cylinder No:1!.. 1-3-4-2!

Hope it helps explain a few things for you!

Cheers

[mjrandom Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close mjrandom]

Grace what year manufacture is your Prado. Be interesting to see if you had the original injectors, the interim injectiors (like mine) or the latest DLC injectors.

[Bushbasher Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Bushbasher]

I say this with tongue in cheek......

WHAT'S WITH THE CHICKY BABES ADVERTISED ON THIS SITE??????

:lol:

And how come no matter where I go in this great state Stella is always only 3 miles away? She must be stalking me.

[Graceilyons64 Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close Graceilyons64]

Grace what year manufacture is your Prado. Be interesting to see if you had the original injectors, the interim injectiors (like mine) or the latest DLC injectors.

My Prado Manufactured 11-2006, from all of the service reports I've seen since 10,000k there is no mention of replacement of injectors or the "40,000" cleaning of injectors. From the photo's I've taken of the 3 injectors that were pulled out by Toyota, they are so covered in charcoal, who can tell?

[Graceilyons64 Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close Graceilyons64]

Gday Graceilyons64


EG:2 Induction = downward stroke/ combustion = upward stroke (360 deg)/ Power = downward stroke/ Exhaust = upward stroke!.. (720 deg) Better to simplify as suck/ Squeeze/ Bang/ Blow!

No gutter talk at this point please guys!.. Lol

Hope it helps explain a few things for you!

Cheers

Thanks Skywalkerrun,

I literally cacked myself at your explanation.....LMAO

more importantly, I got it!

[Bushbasher Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Bushbasher]

Dare I say the "Nissan" word? Piston and engine failures in the Nissan Patrol t/d were likewise not very common, ie you heard about it but they weren't fragging in every street every single day, but the issue received a huge amount of publicity and Nissan had to bite the bullet and act. I wonder what the true numbers were?

[Walter Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Walter]

Well!!! My first post in this thread was on page 2 when my 10/2007 Prado had 18000K. Since then I have had two injector tests by Toyota (cold start), one reflash (that temporarily fixed the problem) and tomorrow I get my Prado back from West End Diesel with new injectors, seats etc at 120000km. I decided to get the new injectors installed after reading about the white smoke on start-up. Mine started doing this just over a month ago (or this is when I first noticed it) so I figured it was finally time to bite the bullet. Initial report is that No 1 injector seat was leaking and that all of the injectors were out of spec (West End Diesel spec). Not cheap but significantly cheaper than a new motor... They have kept the car overnight so that they can do a cold start tomorrow morning.

Cheers

Ron

[Walter Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Walter]

Well!!! My first post in this thread was on page 2 when my 10/2007 Prado had 18000K. Since then I have had two injector tests by Toyota (cold start), one reflash (that temporarily fixed the problem) and tomorrow I get my Prado back from West End Diesel with new injectors, seats etc at 120000km. I decided to get the new injectors installed after reading about the white smoke on start-up. Mine started doing this just over a month ago (or this is when I first noticed it) so I figured it was finally time to bite the bullet. Initial report is that No 1 injector seat was leaking and that all of the injectors were out of spec (West End Diesel spec). Not cheap but significantly cheaper than a new motor... They have kept the car overnight so that they can do a cold start tomorrow morning.

Cheers

Ron

[Octane94 Member Find all posts View Profile Close Octane94]

Replaced all 4 injectors in a d4d hiace today at work under warrenty, has a front mount intercooler so not too sure whats causing these injectors to fail..

[Octane94 Member Find all posts View Profile Close Octane94]

It gets pretty hot in those enclosed engine bays. Hmmm.... interesting. Do you know what injector series that was taken out. Was it 23670-39316 or 23670-39365 part number.
Interesting, as I don't do much work in this type of vehicle.
The Roo.

Roo,

It was 23670-39316 (i think), i have to admit it is a very tight fit under the seat and there aint much airflow.

every d4d i work on (hilux, Prado 120 and 150, Hiace) seems to have the same problems.. fantastic donk if you cancel out injector problems, plenty of grunt for little fuel usage.

Octane.

[Octane94 Member Find all posts View Profile Close Octane94]

Yes those bloody seats and the injectors too. I reckon 130,000 kms is their limit really. I haven't seen to many problems with the 150 models yet out in the commercial land.
The Roo.

Seems like 120 injectors get crucified from the heat of the hot top mount intercooler. (same with hilux)
150 injectors arnt as common as 120 faliures but do happen.
the hiace injectors just dont seem to like the small space?

in the past year there have been about 6 120 injector faliures, 1 150 injector faliure, 4 hilux injector faliures and 2 hiace faliure (all 1KD motor)

not sure if toyota have tried to fix this issue or just hope it doesnt happen....

Octane

[Bushbasher Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Bushbasher]

My Intelligent Tester 2 diagnostic tool arrived today. Once I decipher all the Chinese English I will work out how to plug it in and read the injector values.

[tdprado Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close tdprado]

My Intelligent Tester 2 diagnostic tool arrived today. Once I decipher all the Chinese English I will work out how to plug it in and read the injector values.

I've had mine for about a year now. Let me know if you have any problems. I may be able to help.

Only thing I would say is they are not fast pieces of equipment, so give it time to respond sometimes. You'll be amazed at the amount of info it reveals about your vehicle once you get used to it.

Works on my brand new 150 GXL as well!

[Octane94 Member Find all posts View Profile Close Octane94]

Yes those bloody seats and the injectors too. I reckon 130,000 kms is their limit really. I haven't seen to many problems with the 150 models yet out in the commercial land.
The Roo.

dont know if you know this but i found out today that the toyota hiace injectors have a recall and get replaced no matter the condition...

i might take this oppurtunity for when the injectors in my prado die

[Octane94 Member Find all posts View Profile Close Octane94]

boss never told me anything about overtorqued..

i have about 20 injectors perfectly fine in the warranty pile waiting to be thrown away...