NSW engineering cert for 265 70 17's

[butane8 Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close butane8]

may be a point of interest

You don't even need to tell them it's legal - your insurance paperwork will show the onus is on you to ensure it's legal, all the insurer is interested in is knowing what the options/accessories/mods are that need to be covered in terms of value.

Even if the speedo reads accurately on 70 series tyres, I think you'll find the engineer wants to sting you an extra $250 + GST (or so) for a GPS speedo check. When I was looking into this, I couldn't find an engineer who would certify the larger tyres without doing a speedo check......

as far as i'm aware NRMA wont cover the vechile for off road.. use ..
i had this issue with them and had to source another insurer who does.. food for thought.. butane

[butane8 Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close butane8]

I have just installed Yellow Box V5 with splice wiring (solder connection) on my Grande 120, tested and calibrated speedometer for bigger tyres. I will post my full installation information hopefully in few days time.
The Yellow Box V5 works fine and I am very happy and also particularly thankful to Jenny at Yellow Box who has been excellent in finding the correct solution. For about $79.95USD, or about $76.40AUD, it is a very good value. Thier website and contact details:
www.YellR.com
[email protected]

Cheers
AB

busha looks like a good investment.. watching with interest with the instalation and have stashed the cash for the box .. hope it goes good.. nice mod... cheers butane

[Max Member Find all posts View Profile Close Max]

as far as i'm aware NRMA wont cover the vechile for off road.. use ..
i had this issue with them and had to source another insurer who does.. food for thought.. butane

One of the first things I asked NRMA was if I'd be covered off road and was told as long as I'm not in a comp I'll be covered anywhere. They're not the cheapest but unfortunately I've had to claim a couple of times and never had any hassle.

Nothing to do with certifying new tyres so I'll leave it there

[busha Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close busha]

I have installed the Yellow Box speedo calibrator that works fine on my Grande 120 V6.
All I have been wanting to do is to fit mud terrain tyres legally on my 4WD. Mud terrains are not available in 265x65x17 size and the next best available size is 265x70x17. This tyre is more than 15mm in diameter to the manufactures recommended tyre which will not comply with current NSW law unless it is certified. http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registrati...vsi09_rev4.pdf
RTA have confirmed to me via email that certification is required (VSB 14 is not legislated in NSW).
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registrati...n-creek-qa.pdf
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registrati...n-creek-qa.pdf
After much enquiries I finally found a certifier in Riverwood who was willing to check for certification at a cost of $300+GST. http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registrati...ulletin_01.pdf
He specifically mentioned that my speedo has to be calibrated. Speedometer that reads below the actual speed does not comply with ADR, this website may be helpful: http://www.trafficlaw.com.au/speedos.html So my search begins, I emailed few manufacturers enquiring about their suitability of product on Prado Grande. YellowBox responded positively for testing and I had few correspondence with Jenny at Yellow Box www.YellR.com
who was most helpful and excellent in finding a solution for Prado speedometer [email protected] Finally yellow box supplied me their box with solder joints for testing (they are still working on plug and play version which may not be cost viable depending on cost of connector, etc).
Installation
Refer to instructions provided with the YellowBox unit. There is a good installation guide on Installation of another speedo calibrator brand under this thread (I don’t know anything about its usefulness):
http://www.pradopoint.com/showthread...=certification
The Yellowbox picks up incoming signal to speedometer, modifies the signal via press buttons functions and sends higher or lower speed signals to the speedometer. Prado signal to speedometer comes via the speed sender unit that picks up speed from four ABS speed sensors. The wire supplying the signal to speedometer is at connector IL1 which is located near Left Side of the Blower Unit in front of passenger seat behind the glove box. To access IL1, glove box needs to be removed which is pretty simple: remove the slim clip-on trim above glove box, remove the screws on glove box, disconnect wires and you see bunch of connectors near the blower unit. IL1 is 18 pin connector.
Refer photos below:

There are three important wires: (Note-pins numbers are male connector numbers) Pin 2 white with black stripe wire is earth wire, Pin 5 Pink with Blue stripe wire is the speedometer wire, pin 8 black with red stripe thicker wire is power supply wire. Do not use other wires: Pin 4 green with white stripe wire, Pin 6 Pink with blue stripe wire is skid control, Pin 9 is inclination sensor wire, pins 14, 15, 17, 18 are skid control wires, + blanks. Refer marked up photo below:


Power to IL1 is through ignition key so I removed the keys before any wiring work (removing ground battery terminal is the best practice though). Note: Wires can be held together before soldering by cutting ends of solder filled wire from yellowbox, stripping the insulation, and tightly winding around wire from IL1 or twisting.
1. Unplug the IL1 connector and the disconnected side in your hand has female pins in it.
2. Splice (remove insulation around wire about 10-15mm) white with black stripe earth wire (Pin 2) and solder this to black earth wire from YellowBox.
3. Splice black with red stripe power wire (Pin 8) and solder this to red power wire from YellowBox.
4. Cut pink with blue stripe wire (Pin 5) and strip both ends. Solder the pink with blue stripe wire still connected to pin 5 of IL1 connector to green signal output wire from yellow box. Solder the pink with blue stripe wire now disconnected from pin 5 to yellow speed input signal wire from yellow box. (I would slip heat shrink to both ends of wire before solder for insulation).
Marked up photo of wires after solder:
5. Insulate the wires and connect the Yellow box.

Photo after wires insulated
Calibration
Check that there is power to Yellow box (turn on ignition). Drive the car for very short distance and stop. Check that red and green lights flick / blink.
Now it is time to calibrate. I would take the car for a drive on flat straight high speed road during lowest peak traffic time so that I can effectively check the speed using cruise control.
Use a reliable GPS and check the speedometer reading against the actual speed reading from GPS. Calculate the difference in percentage terms. If my speedometer is reading lower than GPS speed, then I will have a negative percentage difference. 265x65x17 tyre when reading 100km/hr would be doing 103.3km/hr when fitted with 265x70x17 tyre on the same vehicle. http://www.exploroz.com/Vehicle/Tyres/SizeCalc.aspx
I would initially calibrate to -3.3% difference. To do this:
1. Stop the car without switching of ignition and wait for say 1 minute.
2 Press “+” and “-“ button together for 5 seconds (both green and red lights will flicker few times).
3 Press the minus (-) button on yellow box for 3 seconds and which will give three long blinks of green light indicating 3%. Make 3 short push of minus (–) button and each short push will give one short green blink. 3 short blinks indicate 0.3%. So I have at total minus (-) 3.3% calibration.
4 Take the Prado for test run. If there is still speed difference, re-start calibration process until correct speed is obtained. Correct speed for new percentage difference only (ignore previous speed differences). This can be done any number of times until satisfactory result is obtained.

I have placed this small YellowBox unit above the cover near passenger side feet under glove box so that I can remove and re-calibrate speedometer for two sets of wheels that I intend to have. Any other practical suggestion for location and mounting would be helpful!!
Sorry it took me a bit longer to post this but I had to take Prado for over 100km test drive on freeway at 100 to 110Km/hr to make sure there are no error messages or the like at high speeds. I have also driven the Prado on all four wheel drive modes with no issues.
The YellowBox V5 is made in Bundaberg, Queensland with 10 year warranty and available for under $80.00 www.YellR.com. I reckon this is a very good value.
Cheers
AB

[D4D Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close D4D]

I am glad my '08 120 speedo reads spot on with 265/70/17 and they're legal in VIC

[butane8 Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close butane8]

busha , your a dead set legend... thankyou for taking the time to educate us on the set up...

hopefully you can take a minute if i , got any issues with the set up ... no use modifying the ass off a prado if the speedo is out from the first thing we normally do like tyres ...
.. thanks mate i'll buy you a beer.

cheers butane

[busha Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close busha]

busha , your a dead set legend... thankyou for taking the time to educate us on the set up...

hopefully you can take a minute if i , got any issues with the set up ... no use modifying the ass off a prado if the speedo is out from the first thing we normally do like tyres ...
.. thanks mate i'll buy you a beer.

cheers butane

Appreciate your nice comments and beer gesture - thanks mate. I'm non smoker & non drinker and enjoying life.
I'll definetely spare few minutes if I can assist.
Perhaps the only difficult work is soldering the wires together due to conjested space and avoiding melting insulation off other dangling wires. I suggest wrapping other dangling wires not being soldered with very damp / moist thick cotton cloth.
Cheers
AB

[busha Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close busha]

Ok I had the prado looked over by the RMS certifier, and all was good except for the speedo being out. He said about 5% at 100km/h. Unfortunatly the RMS does not allow for the vehicle to traveling faster then the speedo is reading. So I started looking around for a auto electrician that could do the re calibration. And I found one in Canberra. Will cost $250 to fit the product, like the yellr box. Then ill have to pay the certifier about $300.

At least I now have it sorted

Troy

Troy,
Who isyou certifier and their contact details please.
b

[butane8 Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close butane8]

busha . can you p.m me the contact info , you had for yellowbox.com... as emailed them fri , and still no response?

cheers butane

[butane8 Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close butane8]

please explain why your speedo is accurate

I am glad my '08 120 speedo reads spot on with 265/70/17 and they're legal in VIC

why is your speedo accurate with those tyres... ? look at your build up is there something i'm missing?

cheers butane

[Troy1 Member Find all posts View Profile Close Troy1]

why is your speedo accurate with those tyres... ? look at your build up is there something i'm missing?

cheers butane

The later model prados were set from factor with a larger under reading in the speedo. Unlike the earlier ones like mine which read about spot on with orginal tyres.

[butane8 Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close butane8]

thanks i did not know that ....

cheers butane

[busha Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close busha]

busha . can you p.m me the contact info , you had for yellowbox.com... as emailed them fri , and still no response?

cheers butane

Butane
This is the only contact email I have.
[email protected]
You can check their website and also send email.
www.YellR.com

AB
[email protected]

[busha Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close busha]

Just an update on NSW certification.
I had a confirmation via email from one of the Licensed Certifiers that "you are allowed for 50mm increase in nominal diameter without certificate for 4WD MC vehicle". Two other certifiers have told me the same thing.
John from NSW RTA has also confirmed this over telephone this morning at 9.30am. I was also concerend about notification, but John told me that there was NO notification process in place. Ref VSB 14, NCOP11 (item 1.1 page 5):
In NSW, although vehicles whose height has been changed up to 50mm do not require certification by an engineering signatory, the registration authority must be
notified of the modification.
This document would be handy for anyone intersted in "Basic Modification Not Requiring Certification".
http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/roa..._2011%20v3.pdf
Section 4.2.4 requires speedometer accuracy:
"Speedometer accuracy must be maintained for the selected tyre and rim combination to within
the degree of accuracy specified in ADR 18 where applicable".
Cheers
AB

[toddy Member Find all posts View Profile Close toddy]

A friend recently had new tyres installed here in QLD and the tyre manufacturer/installer placed 265/70/R17 on his car and he asked the question and like with Busha post above we are allowed a 50mm increase for a 4WD vehicle.

Thanks,