no catalytic converter?

[spano Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close spano]

Hi All. First post from a relative newbie to the forum.

I have a 1999 VX (built Aug '99) petrol Prado with the TRD supercharger kit which has come from NSW and I am trying to register it in WA. To say I'm having hassles with Transport WA would be putting it mildly.

They've requested an engineer's report for the charger - that goes without saying...
Also they've asked for a noise test and a 5 gas emission test which is where I have a problem.

As far as I can tell from everything I've read, not all 95 series Prado's had a catalytic converter from the factory. Mine does not as instead it uses a CO mixture adjustment screw. I think it's the models with the o2 sensor that had the cat from the factory.

Without a cat I cannot see how the engine would pass a 5 gas test with or without the supercharger and basically they are asking me to fit something that was never there or risk being failed.

I've spoken to dealerships, state and national office for Toyota and quoted my VIN to try and prove that there was NO CAT fitted from new. The inspector has told me that the only way they will change their stance is if I can show them written proof from Toyota stating that my model did not have a cat from new.

The inspector also said that with over 100 years of experience in his office he has never heard of a post 1986 passenger vehicle that does not have at least one catalytic converter. Mine's complianced in the MC category - passenger off road vehicle.

I'm wondering how Toyota gained exemption (have read that cats can be a fire hazard due to such high temps in something like long dry grass)

I have consulted an engineer who is going to certify the supercharger and noise test but I am worried about the 5 gas test result leaving me with an unregisterable 4wd

Any help, pointers or someone in Toyota that I could speak to would be really awesome. I've tried the WA and national Toyota offices and have not gotten anywhere at this stage.

[ntp Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close ntp]

Noting what day it is today... have you also checked to see if you have a flux capacitor?

[spano Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close spano]

Noting what day it is today... have you also checked to see if you have a flux capacitor?

Time circuits on, flux capacitor fluxing.

[Darran K Member Find all posts View Profile Close Darran K]

I have a GXL 99 model and it has no cats. I coulnt believe it either as i had a 96 model V6 VS Como back in the day and it had cats.

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

Hi All. First post from a relative newbie to the forum.

I have a 1999 VX (built Aug '99) petrol Prado with the TRD supercharger kit which has come from NSW and I am trying to register it in WA. To say I'm having hassles with Transport WA would be putting it mildly.

They've requested an engineer's report for the charger - that goes without saying...
Also they've asked for a noise test and a 5 gas emission test which is where I have a problem.

As far as I can tell from everything I've read, not all 95 series Prado's had a catalytic converter from the factory. Mine does not as instead it uses a CO mixture adjustment screw. I think it's the models with the o2 sensor that had the cat from the factory.

Without a cat I cannot see how the engine would pass a 5 gas test with or without the supercharger and basically they are asking me to fit something that was never there or risk being failed.

I've spoken to dealerships, state and national office for Toyota and quoted my VIN to try and prove that there was NO CAT fitted from new. The inspector has told me that the only way they will change their stance is if I can show them written proof from Toyota stating that my model did not have a cat from new.

The inspector also said that with over 100 years of experience in his office he has never heard of a post 1986 passenger vehicle that does not have at least one catalytic converter. Mine's complianced in the MC category - passenger off road vehicle.

I'm wondering how Toyota gained exemption (have read that cats can be a fire hazard due to such high temps in something like long dry grass)

I have consulted an engineer who is going to certify the supercharger and noise test but I am worried about the 5 gas test result leaving me with an unregisterable 4wd

Any help, pointers or someone in Toyota that I could speak to would be really awesome. I've tried the WA and national Toyota offices and have not gotten anywhere at this stage.

Correct, 95 Series Prado of the first generation did not have a catalytic convertor or an o2 sensor. But things are not as dire as you suspect... and I'm here to save the day and provide you with the proof you require!

If you check out this link here... https://infrastructure.gov.au/roads/..._1972_2018.pdf
You'll see a list of the current ADR standards that all light vehicles must comply too. You'll read the ADR and what date it comes into force. Which given the age of your car... it would be ADR 37. EXCEPT!!!!!!!!

The Prado is a bit of a tank. Because of it's kerb weight and it's GVM, its actually identified as a Heavy Duty Vehicle! Which means that the ADR37 is useless against it. It actually has to comply with ADR36/00. Here is where I pull a rabbit out of a hat for you... Fire up your printer and get printing with these links!

First off... pop your bonnet and go to the air cleaner housing. You'll see a sticker like this one.
Notice in the bottom right? "This engine was manufactured to comply with ADR 36/00"

Secondly... pull out a copy of this
https://infrastructure.gov.au/roads/...ign/pdf/36.pdf
This is the original ADR 36/00 and clearly states what categorizes a vehicle into 36/00. Page 2, clause 36.2.2.3 lists what must be on the sticker in the engine bay. The air filter sticker covers that.

It also lists the HC, NOx, CO and CO2 maximum content that is permitted in this classification. Compare that to ADR 37 vehicles and there is a massive difference. Basically, our cars are allowed to kill a few dolphins in their lifetime.

Thirdly, to show him that you've really done your research and that his 100 years of experience obviously doesn't allow for exceptions to the rules, give him this...
http://rvcs.dotars.gov.au/TFI%20Manu...036-00-9-1.pdf
That is an instruction manual for the tester. Tells him exactly how to test an ADR 36/00 vehicle.

Fourth! Open this Excel spreadsheet
https://infrastructure.gov.au/roads/...el_reports.xls
Along the bottom you'll see a list of vehicles. Mostly 4x4s. Click on the tab that says Prado.

This is the limits of ADR 37 vehicles.
HC = 0.25 g/km (ADR37/01)
CO = 2.1 g/km (ADR37/01)
NOx = 0.63 g/km (ADR37/01)

This is what the Prado logs on the butt sniffer machine!
HC = 1.079 g/km
CO = 9.350 g/km
NOx = 4.879 g/km

For further reading... go here!
https://infrastructure.gov.au/roads/...ment/emission/

Hope this helps mate and best of luck!

[spano Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close spano]

That is a lot of useful ammo right there and thanks for taking the time to post such a detailed reply. Really appreciate it mate.

I've digested most of this and like yours mine is also ADR36 and not ADR37 which is what he was assuming with all that collective expertise in the office!

Small update...I called my mate in the inspections dept back today and mentioned the emissions sticker (ADR36) and that it's classed as a "heavy duty vehicle" which may explain the absence of the cat. He asked me to hold and 5 minutes later asked for the vehicle GVM and approval code on the compliance plate. He then said he'd call back which he did in under 10 minutes. So he now is still asking for the 5 gas test so he can try to gauge what effect the supercharger has had on emissions. Surprisingly the cat is no longer relevant...for now at least depending on results I think. Oh, and it would seem that we're now BFF's as he opened up a bit and became quite helpful. He even recommended where to take it for the gas test and said I can drop off the results to him personally.

Engineer tomorrow and will try to get the gas test done late next week.

Thanks again RanJ it looks like I owe you a beer mate!

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

There is a very good chance you'll show better results with the charger than without. The blower acts as an air pump, diluting the emissions. Ford were known for doing this in the states. Not supercharging, but putting an air pump on the motor so it would dump air into the exhaust gases and dilute the crap out of them... cheeky... but it worked!

If for some reason it doesn't pass the sniffer, post your results and I'll give you some tips to try.

First off though, with half a tank of fuel, use an entire bottle of a good quality fuel system cleaner, run that tank dry and then fill it back up completely. This will dilute the remainder plus also if it goes in with a full tank, the evap canister won't purge itself. This can cause fluctuating readings when it's switching on and off. Secondly, run a really really good upper cylinder head cleaner through it. I use to use one that I'd actually slowly vacuum feed into the motor over a half hour period. Keep am eye on the exhaust pipe. The blacker the crap coming out the better. Also reset the ecu and gone the car an Italian tune up before rolling in for the test. This will have it running a touch on the lean side during the test which can push HC up a little but drastically reduces NOx.

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

Just thinking about it... I dont think the 5 gas analyser will be deemed as relevant. I think the 36/00 require the test to be performed under different conditions to be relevant. Specifically, under load on a dyno. ADR37 vehicles are tested at idle and again at a higher rpm but stationary and in neutral. This could work very well in your favour. Since the emissions would be much higher should you be loaded up close to your GVM and driving along.

That's bugging me now. I was just about to crawl into bed when I heard all the ADR folders calling me from my office. Now... here I sit, in my office at 11:20pm, cup of coffee and folders opened everywhere. All to satisfy my own curiosity.

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

Found it... clause 36.8.2 Analytical systems. Clearly shows only three gases that matter with these engines. HC CO and CO2

[VK6YBA Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close VK6YBA]

I also have been down the compliance in WA route with a 1986 front wheel drive Escort I imported from the UK [privtely]. I can't remember the exact details but it had to have anti-intrusion bars fitted in the doors, a cat fitted and some other stuff as well that did not apply when the vehicle was built. I argued with the "man" but to no avail. As soon as it got it's compliance sticker I got the cat off of it PDQ! The fact it was privately imported made no difference. I seem to remember the compliance plate said something along the lines of "privately imported vevicle not required to comply with ADR****** can't remember the numbers. THis meant it did not have to have a cat, AI bars etc. Made no difference to the "man"! Har Har

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

Lol. Yeah they can be buggers! Unfortunately in your situation they did have you over a barrel. Fitting a cat to a car not designed to have one can have nasty side effects on the motor. Especially a forced induction motor. As the cat suddenly puts a lot of back pressure on a system that wasn't designed for that amount. Some back pressure is good... a lot is not!

[VK6YBA Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close VK6YBA]

Hi Ranj. It went heaps better without the cat!! Funny that.

[spano Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close spano]

RanJ, a curious mind is a wonderful thing. Thanks again for for the really useful help on this...I am certainly feeling a lot more informed hence more confident that this will work out okay than I was a few days ago. I hope the 5 gas is now more of a formality than anything. The engine runs very well as it is fortunately. When I changed the plugs a few months ago I was amazed how good they looked having been in there for 35000km in a 215000km engine. Slight electrode wear which is par for the course with a wasted spark system but otherwise they were pretty bloody clean. I dumped some Wynns in and ran through both tanks about 6 months ago just for fun. The upper cylinder cleaner you mentioned...that's like the Seafoam stuff that the Yanks rave about isn't it? I have considered using it in the past to maybe remove a bit of carbon but changed my mind. Before I got it the car was run on E10 for a few years. I've only used 98 since so it should be running about as clean as it's ever going to be. MAF sensor is a new calibrated unit and I fitted a K&N which I will definitely swap for the standard air cleaner element for the test. I'll clean the MAF again as well...it's amazing the difference a dirty MAF makes to poor performance and economy on these engines.

That's really interesting about the evap system not purging with a full tank so I'll make sure I'm under half full when going in :-)
Also checked the ECU for any stored fault codes and nothing so I reset it anyway, as I do every few months.

The engineer examined it today. He seemed happy with the installation and rightly so. The TRD charger sits so nicely in there like it's part of the engine. Re the noise test, the exhaust measured 88dB @ 3500rpm so all good there too. That's with Pacemaker headers and a 2 1/2 system.

VK6YBA, interesting story. A mate of mine had to do the same thing with a Stagea import in South Australia. It makes sense that you'll get better performance without a cat as it's one less restriction. I don't want to do what many have probably done and weld one in for the inspection and then remove it. Maybe I won't need to...time will tell.

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

Yeah upper cylinder cleaner is seafoam type stuff. It's amazing how much crap it removes. Good luck.

[baders Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close baders]

Yeah upper cylinder cleaner is seafoam type stuff. It's amazing how much crap it removes. Good luck.

I ran this when I first fired mine up after SC installation.

I've not done any engineering etc on mine yet as it was already registered, but will probably look into it soon. It runs super clean but is fairly loud, as I have Pacemakers with 2.5 inch system, but with the silencer and muffler removed and replaced with a single large muffler at the rear. I fear it would fail any noise test, which is infuriating, when you get blasted with noise any time a Harley passes within 50m of you

I had several run ins with the Authoritae when trying to import a 1989 BMW M635 last year. The car was 1 month past the cut off date for import yet still they would not bend, and could not even supply a reason for having the rule any more !