Grande Airbag Retaining after a Lift

[MidLifeCrisis]

Ok guys, there have been some questions pm'd to me regarding my rear air bags (Grande). I got under the rig and note mine look just like everyone elses. I took a picture (under duress) Craig! ;p

You can see mine are welded where Craig is considering the pin. If I was to sit with a Toyo engineer I would get hm to lengthen the seating pin (at bottom) and then pin it to absolutely prevent it popping out. I.E. Craig's idea!!

[Justo]

There is also a trick to removing the tube. detail as follows. I dont know if the "tube removal" tool is really required. It may even come in the kit?

It's not required, just need a flat screwdriver or similar to push the clamp in as you pull the tube out. The worst of it is working half blind and trying to get you hands up in there to disconnect it.
Check the o-rings but most likely they will still be fine to go back in.

[Justo]

It is the base you need to mod, and would suggest the keyed option is the way to go if you have the keyed seat there already. At least the bag is still easy to remove if ever needed. It shouldn't take much to stop them jumping out, maybe drill and tack weld some 5mm round bar through would do the trick.
Half the problem is the increased angle of the seat as the axle reaches full articulation . The airbagman bags don't have a key or anything locking the base either but the increased length sorts out that problem, they never look like jumping off even with the longer travel shocks and the high setting selected (which would be about 870mm ride height).

[1coolbanana]

I cant really see how a spacer could be added to the top of the airbag with the valve and securing clip on the top of the bag.

I agree, unlikely any mods are done at the top, its just too busy up there.

[craigm]

On Way2go's rig, maybe there's a mod to add a 50mm spacer ABOVE the airbag to increase the effective length?

I cant really see how a spacer could be added to the top of the airbag with the valve and securing clip on the top of the bag.

[Peterpilot]

And same as mine!
Maybe there is no secret mod on some installs and its not been an issue?????
Is it really necessary????

You'd probably get away with it most of the time, but it is an issue with tweaked airbags off-road when the suspension is articulated:

Trust me the airbags can jump off their seats once you start tweaking them up and put them under some heavy articulation. I had it happen a couple of times... You don't want the bags jumping out when you're in the middle of nowhere as you will be riding the bump stops all the way home unless you manage to get them back in..which contrary to all reports..can be done but its a pain in the a#$# to do!

On Way2go's rig, maybe there's a mod to add a 50mm spacer ABOVE the airbag to increase the effective length?

[1coolbanana]

And same as mine!
Maybe there is no secret mod on some installs and its not been an issue?????
Is it really necessary????

[craigm]

Thanks W2G. Same as Peter's & Mine. It would appear (at least from this pic), that unless there is some obvious retaining strap installed then there's been no "secret mod" or anything else done on your rig to assist in the retaining of the airbags. Details in your signature do mention "recalibrated airbags". I dare say that they have either adjsuted the height sensor, or possibly used the airbagman (pic) using spacers. Being the same year as ours also (2004), your Grande has the same "keyless" pin. It would be interesting to see if the later models (2008/9) have the same system.

[Way2go]

I only managed to have a quick look underneath on the weekend, and the drivers side looked no different to the below.

Will have to spend a bit more time under there and see if I can see anything else....

[Peterpilot]

I would be interested in finding out what Mitchell Bros solution is also. So far I have heard of several ways to solve the problem of the factory airbags popping:

1 - Airbag Man airbag replacement kit (longer airbag)
2 - Retainer strap as previously used by ATS4X4 (supports airbag at extension limit)
3 - Captive retainer pin as suggested by 1coolbanana (stops airbag from unseating by captive pin)
4 - Welding a retainer solution as used by Auto-Craft (still unsure of what exactly this involves)
5 - Limiting strap; not used by anyone but available on-line here (limits suspension extension)
6 - 50mm spacer on rear airbag as used by Opposite Lock (adds 50mm to length of standard airbag)

[Way2go]

I'll have to try getting under mine when it comes back from the shop (CV repairs) to see if I can identify what the 'Mitchell Bros' secret solution is as well.

[Peterpilot]

Im still not quite sure I get what the straps do!
Do they physically limit the downward travel of the diff assembly?

The way it was explained to me was that the strap prevented the air bag from popping out toward the rear of the vehicle by providing some support at the back of the air bag as the suspension reached full droop. If the straps are the correct length, they should be fully extended at the same point as the shock absorber reaches maximum travel.

However, limiting straps that prevented suspension from over extending and exceeding the limit of air bag extension would also work to prevent air bags unseating.

[Peterpilot]

With the bottom air bag pin captive there shouldn't be an issue with stretching the air bag, providing the shock absorbers are not so long that they allow the airbag to over extend. The shock absorber is generally the limiting factor of rear suspension extension. Standard shocks and most aftermarket shocks like Bilstein etc designed for a maximum of 40-50mm lift should be OK, but long travel shocks like Icon, 80 series Landcruiser, or Superior Engineering SRC shocks would be a problem.

However, if the shock absorber was to break, then there is a real possibility of damaging the air bag. It could be torn apart if there was no shock absorber to limit travel, a far more serious issue than a conventional steel spring simply popping out.

[craigm]

From my understanding thats exactly what they do (limit the downward travel of the diff asembly), however the idea is to protect the airbag from dropping out. (same as a spring with limited recoil dropping out I guess). I would really like to now what was done with MidLifeCrisis's Grande. he mentions in his build up page "They used the Darren from Autocraft method. Bilstein shocks all round with easy rider springs in the front and some secret adjusting and welding on the rear air bags". Welding??? I might send MLC a PM to ask him if he could takes some pics for us (if anything obvious can be seen). this may shed some light for us on this conundrum...

[1coolbanana]

Im still not quite sure I get what the straps do!
Do they physically limit the downward travel of the diff assembly?
That would seem to kind of defeat the purpose of longer travel suspension if it limits its travel wouldnt it???