My engine chipping experience so far

[Chip It]

skywalkerrun, if you are seriously interested in learning about 0-5 volts signals, signal emulation, the interpolation of these signals, and the correlation of these signals between one and another I do not believe it is my place to disseminate this info.

In my opinion, forums like these are here for those that wish to eat the fruit, not to study the roots. Also, I am on the forum to help people see the benefits and for those that have the experienced these benefits of our labour to share with others.

Sorry to be a stick in the mud of you but I cannot start to advise you on these points more than what I already have.

Clearly you say that we override Toyota safety protocols and others don't. You have no basis to form this opinion and in fact we don't override any safety features. The the addition of the EGT controller we are adding safety to what the industry has so far neglected.

[SWR]

Hello chipit

Quote from chipit: you misunderstand what the secondary signal does

Question to chipit: Yes i have clearly misunderstood what the secondary signal does as i am having problems with your interpretations so could you please explain what it is that you are actually doing with that return signal before it is forwarded to the ECU and i will keep in mind that the signal that is being forwarded is in "correlation" with the primary signal... So what has happened to that secondary signal (If anything) before being forwarded?...

Quote from chipit: and do I believe I read correctly that you are saying our Chip will, in-time, cause issues

Question to chipit: You will have to point out exactly where "i" said "Quote from chipit": that you are saying our Chip will, in-time, cause issues un-quote.

Quote from skywalkerrun: "what is the sustainability on long term engine life span now that you have managed to over-ride the engine protection perimeters put in place by Toyota and the other chips leave in play"

Answer from skywalkerrun: I believe that "if" you have intercepted and manipulated both the primary and return signals then wouldn't it have compromised a safety perimeter that was put in place by Toyota due to the signals being manipulated from there former state?.... Are these signals from the fuel rail sensor?

Quote from chipit: But to make this clear ... no we don't over-ride any safeties.

Question from skywalkerrun: so clearly i need an explanation on the primary and secondary correlation?

Quote from chipit: Correct me if I am wrong or misread your stance / opinion.

Answer from skywalkerrun: I beleave that you "have" "Quote from chipit": "misread your stance / opinion"7 "Un-quote". as i am only asking you what is happening to the primary & secondary signals as you state that you intercept them....

Link below
http://www.pradopoint.com/showthread...l=1#post351975

Here is the link to my "original" questions. (It was "not" a stance or opinion) but purely questions).
http://www.pradopoint.com/showthread...l=1#post351975

Cheers

[Chip It]

you misunderstand what the secondary signal does and do I believe I read correctly that you are saying our Chip will, in-time, cause issues.

You wrote "now that you have managed to over-ride the engine protection perimeters put in place by Toyota ..."

In this sentence you are saying we over-ride the engine protection AND THUS put the engine at risk.

Correct me if I am wrong or misread your stance / opinion.

But to make this clear ... no we don't over-ride any safeties or put the engine at risk by modifying both signals.

The secondary signal is a voltage correlation between a and b signals. By not having a tune box that does both signals other companies mismanage the signals and the factory ECU sees this offset and throws up a code. Basic speak ... they don't do it correctly.

Hope this clarifies. If I am misunderstanding maybe someone can explain to me.

Cheers

[SWR]

Gday Chipit

Quote: We do not short circuit these at all. Don't know why you thought we did

Answer: I did not at any point insinuate that you short these circuits?

My Quote: what is the sustainability on long term engine life span now that you have managed to over-ride the engine protection perimeters put in place by Toyota and the other chips leave in play?

Question: When you intercept the secondary variables in what way are you modifying those signals in-order to stop the CEL which is usually triggered when engine sensors are running outside of there original mapped perimeters.

I am not asking for trade secretes but more on how the engine can protect its self if normal data feed back is being modified when intercepted and normally the engine management can protect its self based on data feed back that you are modifying.

Question: If "all engine safety features are retained" what are you doing to the secondary fuel rail feed back data to stop up-setting the ECU (normally followed by a CEL)... Is this so the ECU does not know true fuel rail pressures (I call it a safety feature) and can no longer drop fuel line pressures when out side of its original mapped perimeters.

I do not want to come across as trying to undermine your credibility as good competition is "always welcome" and strongly encouraged as it forces all other competitors on there toes and this makes better/cheaper products for us the consumer but what you are claiming does not appear to be adding-up and i am not sure what i am missing as far as the engine being able to protect its self when you are intercepting and modifying the secondary signals.

Cheers

[Chip It]

Every chip on the market can increase engine temps ... EVERY ONE! We just choose to give customers peace of mind with ours and have this option so that if (say driving up a long steep hill towing a heavy van or boat etc) the engine were getting up to a EGT level that is higher than factory, the Chip would de-tune itself.

Considering that other chip sellers (I say "seller" because none of them actually manufacture [as we do]) do not have an EGT controller we have nothing but good will from our clients that thank us for at least having a safety device like this as an option in the first place.

Remember that what kills mechanical parts such as engine, gearboxes, diffs is heat and revs. Argument can thus be made that if the engine is producing more torque at MUCH LOWER engine revs, there is no need to wring its neck to get it to go so you may actually be saving your engine!!!

All engine safety features are retained. We do not short circuit these at all. Don't know why you thought we did. I mentioned that others are not intercepting the secondary signal but this is not a safety feature ... it is their mistake ... not their advantage!

[pinko351]

In my experience my EGT's have been lowered by the chip while adding more power. To back this up, I recently had the Prado serviced and removed the chip.
I then had to tow my horse float carrying 2 horses before I had time to refit the chip. Straight away the difference was incredible, I was constantly having to back off due to the EGT raising to and above 600c.
Alternatively with the chip fitted I'm able to (with in reason) maintain legal speed limits while keeping the EGT around 500-550c.
While switching back to the standard factory program may be required for the higher settings, for my mind at setting 5 (in my case) my engine is safer while running on the chip.

[SWR]

Gday Chip It

Would it be a fair question to ask!

Quote: The Chip It Performance ECU intercepts both Primary & Secondary signals and all value changes are made in correlation to each other.

Answer: Can the engine still protect its self from over fueling thus more fuel/ more heat!.... Is this where the EGT (Exhaust Gas Temperature) probe has to jump in to "shut the chip down" mode in order to let the normal engine temps to regain or will the engine rely on solely coolant temps if no EGT is fitted?

Quote: hence why we get more power than others without CEL (Check Engine Light) issues

Answer: Despite you claiming more power than others (No brand naming) without CEL issues what is the sustainability on long term engine life span now that you have managed to over-ride the engine protection perimeters put in place by Toyota and the other chips leave in play?

Cheers

[Chip It]

BTW. we have been getting a whole lot of enquiries lately about why we get more power than the opposition.

The answer to this is in the 2007+ Hilux and Prado D4-D Fuel Rail chips that come out of Europe only intercept the Primary Fuel Rail signal and do not intercept the Secondary on the 6 Wire Fuel Rail Sensor. As a result the Hilux and Prado's factory ECU correlates the Primary & Secondary signals ( ie does a self diagnostic) and when the two signals are out by more than 10% (as will be the case with those other chips) the factory ECU throws up a signal correlation Limp mode and Check Engine Light (CEL) code. The Chip It Performance ECU intercepts both Primary & Secondary signals and all value changes are made in correlation to each other, hence why we get more power than others without CEL issues.

I hope this helps explain this point clearly. Let me know if you need further info

Cheers

[malenymac]

Robert, Thank you for your comprehensive reply. I certainly agree with others in this forum that you have certainly gone out of your way to assist and explain in detail the virtues of your product and you have convinced me!.

[Chip It]

Yes, that's correct. switch can be used as long as the engine is not running. I get asked this question regarding switching on the fly mainly so sorry for not explaining this correctly.

LIAP thanks for clarifying this.

Cheers

[LargeInAPrado]

Robert i think your wording isnt quite right.

Yes you can have a switch to power to switch on and off the chip , i do and its fine, just dont switch it on whilst driving, as long as the switch on is done before starting no issue, the switch off i have been able to do at any time without issue so far (last seen looking for wood to touch)

[Chip It]

Hi malenymac

Answers as follows.

1) if chips caused mass engine issues you would read about it in every magazine, every forum and every 4WD meet you ever attend. The truth is there is no extra engine issues over the standard issues you see on ANY engine. Classic example: the Nissan ZD30 engine was so problematic (blowing piston crown clean off due to poor cooling) that Nissan was providing warranty for them even after warranty had expired! We know many that added our chips and our other performance parts (like LPG injection systems) to these engine and I honestly have only ever heard of one engine that fail (he had LPG injection fitted). Nissan rebuilt his engine free ... no questions asked. Moreover, I know people that fanatically serviced their ZD30 engine every 5000 kms and their engine STILL failed.

Another guy I know (Tony, who owns an Italian restaurant in Manly) called me up about 5 months ago. He told me he was keen to have our chip fitted and wanted to deal direct because his 4WD specialist, with whom he spent $30,000+ to kit out his rig, fitted steinbauyer chips and he couldn't tell them any different. On the first call he told me that he will buy in 2 weeks as Toyota had his car in for an engine rebuild. i asked him what happened. He told me he was driving down the road and suddenly there was a large rattle rattle rattle. He took it into the local Toyota dealer and they stripped down the head and called it "failed injectors. He told me he serviced the car religiously but one injector had dropped the injector tip into the combustion chamber. That was the rattle he heard! He said Toyota were giving him grief and didn't want to fix it under extended warranty. He stood his ground with toyota as he knew he had not done anything wrong and that the injector just failed. He got the result he was after. Finally, they agreed. 2 weeks and $13,001 later (yes that was the bill) he called up as promised and ordered a chip. He had a 2008 D4D Hilux with only 40,000 kms on the clock. (I know because I went to meet the guy and I can tell you the car was like new and he HAD spent shite load on it)

So the moral of the story is that engines fail. We are smart about it and make the Chips totally stealthy even when on the car Toyota cannot detect the chip with their scan tool even whilst the Chip is still on the vehicle. When Chip is removed there is no footprint left. This means you can safely remove the chip before going back to dealer to get any warranty work and they wont try and get you to believe the chip caused the failure.

Second point to make here is that Toyota Racing Developments MAKE THEIR OWN DIESEL CHIPS !! They are available from TRD Dealers in the UK when you purchase a car through them. Valued at circa $3000 they certainly know how to charge. But more importantly, if chips caused an issue Toyota would not stick their name on products that coarse issues.

Point is: If an engine was going to fail, it will with or without the chip. Of course here, I am talking about what I know as a definite ... ie OUR Chips and OUR tunes.

Answer to q. 2) The Toyota is one vehicle that cannot have the chip turned off via a switch to power. What we can do is set up a secondary tune within the Chip ECU to switch between performance tune and factory tune ... essentially that is exactly what the EGT Controller option does with our chip. Once the EGTs get too hot the EGT controller tells our chip to switch over to the factory tune (and back again when temps stabilise)


3) yes I recommend it. Makes sense any way you look at it ... and still is cheaper than the opposition ... even without the forum discount

If you do not want to have it visible you can stick it up under the dash. Its all automatic so no need to have it in view.

Hope this helps

Cheers

Wow - what an interesting discussion! After many hours of reading this forum today I have decided I will need a chip for my 2009, 120 series D4D which I plan to to tow a 2.4t loaded van. However some questions?
1) Does the chip have any adverse affects to your vehicle when doing a lot of low range 4wding?
2) Can the unit be switched off without unplugging it?
3) Given my towing 2.4t, do you believe the EGT essential? (Besides which I am running out of interior space for the unit having already fitted UHF, TMS and mobile cradle and soon a Scanguage and brake controller unit!)

[malenymac]

Wow - what an interesting discussion! After many hours of reading this forum today I have decided I will need a chip for my 2009, 120 series D4D which I plan to to tow a 2.4t loaded van. However some questions?
1) Does the chip have any adverse affects to your vehicle when doing a lot of low range 4wding?
2) Can the unit be switched off without unplugging it?
3) Given my towing 2.4t, do you believe the EGT essential? (Besides which I am running out of interior space for the unit having already fitted UHF, TMS and mobile cradle and soon a Scanguage and brake controller unit!)

[barryswanson]

I had mine changed to a straight through awhile ago (6 months) and it's just started to make a bit of noise. Not enough to be of annoyance but loud enough for passengers to comment. I think it's taken awhile for the glass packing to burn in and fill up with soot. It sounds tuff when the engine is labouring. But with a Chip-It chip, straight through muffler, egr restricting plate, shimmed fuel limiter and snorkel I have a bloody quick and efficient D4-D.

[noahboy]

didnt really worry about a name brand exhaust , changed out with a free flowing exhaust , cut and weld , no difference with note

there are a couple of other guys who have changed the muffler out on the forum , so thought i would give it a go , $150 bucks

noahboy