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prado-admin · 13-02-2006, 10:30 PM

Hi Salties,

I'm no mechanic by any means but through all your accessories you haven't installed a snorkel or any method to let the Prado breathe a bit better.

I'm installing one in the next couple of weeks so I'll let you know how it goes & if it makes a difference to fuel figures.

The other thing you may consider is the HiClone. Some people think these are great. They are also a lot cheaper than the Chip and they are supposed to have a 30 money back guarantee.

I'm thinking about getting two of them as well.

embi · 13-02-2006, 10:54 PM

I dont know about those hiclone things... seems a waste of time...I've only heard bad reports

Salties · 13-02-2006, 11:15 PM

Hi Aaron, Never was really keen on the snorkel although makes sense that it would make things breath better, better for water crossing and less dust etc may have to change my opinion on them. Not sure on the Hiclone seems embi has heard not so good reports either. I have been quoted
$ 1190 for the DP Chip and there is a special cash back next month of $100 makes it a little less painful. I have planned a six week trip at the end of May towing a Jayco Outback Camper up to the Kimberley and feel that having the DP Chip would be certainly usefull during the trip if it lives up to it's expectation and most that you talk to claim that they do.

prado-admin · 14-02-2006, 07:42 AM

I was talking to the guys at ARB up here is Brisbane and one of them told me they were going out of the chips.

They had a few instances where people had installed them, got a friend who was a diesel fitter or mechanic to wind up the turbo to get more boost.

After driving for hours through the heat on trips engines failed.

ARB had to recover these vehicles only to find that people had wound up the turbo.

Everything I've heard about them is great as long as you don't play with the boost.

It's all hearsay of course...

Guest · 14-02-2006, 10:01 AM

I am new to the this forum so hello.

First of all, what is a DP chip?

Second, what sort of fuel figures are you getting Saltie?

I have a 2002 GXL TD. Have pretty much the same accessories as mentioned by Saltie except my roof rack is the heavier ARB style and I have a snorkel.

Fitted a couple of Hiclones when we lived in Darwin (one between the air cleaner and turbo the other in the pipe at the trottle body). Despite the bad press I think these really do work. I was getting 10.5 L/100 km around town after fitting them. The first thing I noticed was the bottom end pickup was better so I changed up sooner and stayed in higher gears. Basically I stopped driving like it has a petrol engine.

I began to get a little sceptical about them, so I took them off. My god didn't the performance drop and fuel use go up. As a example I drive from the Gold Coast to the Hinterland daily (very hilly). I've just got 600 km out of the main tank (approx 11.6 L/100km).

Had a Dtronic fitted about 6 months later. What a difference. Mate in his 3.0 Td GU could keep up and I was towing a boat! The best example of the power difference was passing a road train, up hill, with the boat in fifth (no change down) and zipped past at 120 kph. That was when I knew it was worth what I had spent. Mind you a Dtronic won't necesarily reduce fuel consumption.

I'm now looking at getting a Mandrel bend exhaust which they claim reduces fuel consumption and increases bottom end torque. At $900 I'll wait a while.

Salties · 14-02-2006, 08:44 PM

Wizard thanks for the responce.

Not realy sure what the precise fuel figures are but they used to be about 11 to 11.5 when the vehicle was new with all the standard gear. I used to get 650 to 700km on the main tank and about and about 500 to 550 on the sub tank. Now I would be lucky to get 600 on the main and 400 on the sub. Although I am concious about the fuel consumption I use the vehicle mainly for work and the cost of the fuel is covered by the company and therefore the fuel is not the major issue for my situation.
The power however is dissapointing especialy when I thought the vehicle went up hills very good initially. Do you have simular sized tyre with an increase form the standard 265 70 to the 265 75?
Just to mention as well that mine is an auto and not a manual as the manual was not an option on the Grande.
As for the DP chip this is the direct oposition for D-tronic previously
U tune it that is produced by Beruma Diesel. These unit seemto be more available and recommended over the D-tronic as they are easy to fit, are re usable for various model vehicles as there is only a few models in total and has an adjustment between 0-10. The original setting is at 4. Most people probably come undone and go straight to ten and then obviously start to use extra fuel and blow more smoke etc. I intend just to leave it at the recommended setting. As you have mentioned on the D tronic and I feel that they would be extremely close products to each other that the difference when they are fitted are astounding. I have made the decission to purchase one of these units I am just not sure that the vehicle is working properly or that I am getting paranoid. With the oil on the manofold of the turbo I just was wandering wether there is something wrong with the turbo.
I have also noticed that the heat under the bonnet seems a little high and a sign of this is that the dual battery (deep cycle Trojan) has slightly melted to the mould of the support bracket on top along the edges, only slightly but has only happened recently maybe due to some of the extreme hot weather, not sure but as for the temperature gauge on the dash it never ever moves from the position it reaches when warmed up.
One last thing while we are on the mechanical topic any suggestion on brands of brake pads. I had steered away from the genuine pads and had gone to a softer compound which certainly felt alot better for day to day driving although I had them faid on me once. I have had both the Bendix 4x4 and now the Benidex standard on the rear and they are ok but still am not convinced they are the best. I would prefer a softer pad with maybe a little more resistance to higher temperature especially for towing etc. I must admit I am not the most lightest on the brake pedal and the Auto probably doesent help. Look forward to all your responces.

Guest · 15-02-2006, 02:23 PM

Not sure about a dial-up plug in power unit; as you pointed out some people just go to 10 thinking it will do the trick.

Reading your story it appears it is not unlike mine. Had a stock standard vehicle then added all this heavy, non-aerodynamic accessories that have had an adverse effect on your fuel consumption on performance.

I removed my roof rack for a few months and found the performance and fuel consumption better. Problem is it is a pain to remove and re-fit for trips so I've left it on. Perhaps I could remove the 40-50 kg of recovery gear and the rear drawers as well.

Not sure about brake pads. Being a manual I tend to use the brake pedal less than an auto would. After 85,000+ km I still have the original pads.

johna · 16-02-2006, 08:46 PM

Hi to all contemplating changes to forced fuel feeding...

Suggest you check out an article posted here
http://www.lcool.org/technical/elec_die ... uning.html

I have towed a 2500kg caravan round Aust. and up the middle and down east coast (total 47,000 klm's of towing) and stay on speed limit everywhere where safety permits.
Have thought about adding a chip many times (and still do) but allways come back to the same conclusion, the 3ltr diesel 2003 has done everything well, and a lot better than a lot of others, including a couple of Cruisers, so why load the motor any more and use more fuel if it does what is needed of it, just because I want a 6000hp dragster under me.
:roll:
John

Guest · 17-02-2006, 11:51 AM

You're not exactly comparing apples with apples. You obviously have a 120 series. The discussion until now has been about 90 series TD.

Although both vehicles have same engine, the layout of the air intake of the 120 series, for instance, is substanially different to the 90 series which, in my lay opinion, may have some effect on the engine performance.

The 120 series air intake is next to the turbo. The cold air has less distance to travel to the turbo and less chance of loosing speed and density due to heat.

While the 90 Series is on the opposite side, a distance of aover a metre!.
By the time the cold air has got to the turbo it has lost velocity and been adverserly effected by the engine heat (it does pass behind the radiator as well). I fitted a Hiclone between the filter housing and turbo which has
assisted the air velocity to the turbo. You may wish to accept that or not, but I can feel the difference and see the increase fuel use without it.

I don't feel as though I got a drag car. I feel I have better torque and power response at low revs with added pull uptop.

I also tow a caravan with the Prado for 5 years. It now tows even better.

johna · 17-02-2006, 12:39 PM

Sorry you took me the wrong way Wiz.........

Quote:
"Have thought about adding a chip many times (and still do) but allways come back to the same conclusion, the 3ltr diesel 2003 has done everything well, and a lot better than a lot of others, including a couple of Cruisers, so why load the motor any more and use more fuel if it does what is needed of it, just because I want a 6000hp dragster under me."

I was refering the extra power added, against what the vehicle is capable of in standard form.
More power in a diesel IS, more fuel, more heat..

As I said, I would love to have a dragsters hp to satisfy the boy in me, BUT, need to keep it all in balance.

Would STILL recommend anyone contemplating an add-on, look at the site below before making a choice of power booster.

http://www.lcool.org/technical/elec_die ... uning.html

John

Guest · 17-02-2006, 12:48 PM

TD Upgrade

John,
I understood what you were saying, but the 120 series does have some obvious plumbing improvements to assist airflow. Like all cars I seem to buy they fix things up in the next model.

I have not noticed any additional heat production since fitting the Dtronic. I also can't measure a lot of the other side effects of these improvements as mentioned in LCOOL. Perhaps someone will in the future and give us the figures.

I guess we're all trying to get the most out of our little 3.0 4 pot diesels without having to get a 100 series TD (when I win lotto).

DaveO · 21-02-2006, 10:49 PM

Re: Performance/Fuel

Originally posted by Salties

First of all it is excellent to see such a site and I am looking forward to obtaining some usefull ideas from owners of the same vehicle.

Well I have a Prado 90 2002 TD Grande and like most of us like to set up the vehicle with accessories to complete our 4wd/touring vehicle.

lot of snip snip

... for those who have installed a Chip (previously U-Tune it) would greatly appreciate some feed back.

Cant tell you much about them, but I've a different unit fitted that works well Diesel Tuning Module thats been to then top of cape york, across the deserts, and thru the high country. Its made a huge difference to performance - wish I'd fitted something like that from new! Its can even be adjusted to allow for other enhancements.

No increase in temperature seen on the temp gauge above driving the place in the same conditions.

DaveO · 21-02-2006, 11:03 PM

Originally posted by Aaron

I was talking to the guys at ARB up here is Brisbane and one of them told me they were going out of the chips.

They had a few instances where people had installed them, got a friend who was a diesel fitter or mechanic to wind up the turbo to get more boost.

After driving for hours through the heat on trips engines failed.

ARB had to recover these vehicles only to find that people had wound up the turbo.

Everything I've heard about them is great as long as you don't play with the boost.

It's all hearsay of course...

increasing the boost on a properly set up modern electronically controlled factory diesel engine should have little effect on power, since its fuel that generates the power, and increasing the boost only adds air - not fuel. Ex factory the 1KZ-TE engine is not over fuelled! Excessive boost will also set errors in the ECU (and trhe dealer can read these).

Generating extra boost (particularly at high load) will generate more heat because air is being compressed more (remember the high school physics lessons?). Some of this extra heat will make it into the engine, and over extended high load operation can lead to pre-mature failures. Winding up the boost would require fitting a different wastegate actuator, or an aftermarket boost controller (unless you butcher it by miss adjusting or bending the actuator linkage).

Same as will shutting off the engine will lead to early turbo failure after working the engine hard immediately before shut down. If thats how you drive - get an intelligent turbo timer.

DaveO · 21-02-2006, 11:10 PM

Originally posted by WIZARD

You're not exactly comparing apples with apples. You obviously have a 120 series. The discussion until now has been about 90 series TD.

Although both vehicles have same engine, the layout of the air intake of the 120 series, for instance, is substanially different to the 90 series which, in my lay opinion, may have some effect on the engine performance.

The 120 series air intake is next to the turbo. The cold air has less distance to travel to the turbo and less chance of loosing speed and density due to heat.

While the 90 Series is on the opposite side, a distance of aover a metre!.
By the time the cold air has got to the turbo it has lost velocity and been adverserly effected by the engine heat (it does pass behind the radiator as well). I fitted a Hiclone between the filter housing and turbo which has
assisted the air velocity to the turbo. You may wish to accept that or not, but I can feel the difference and see the increase fuel use without it.

I don't feel as though I got a drag car. I feel I have better torque and power response at low revs with added pull uptop.

I also tow a caravan with the Prado for 5 years. It now tows even better.

Ah you are so right about the sub standard (from a performance perspective) design of the induction system.

It only gets worse if you add a snorkel on the 90 series TD, more (and sharp) bends are added with the snorkel installation. Definite loss of performance after the snorkel went on (until the issue was fixed by further mods).

Wish you well with the hiclone - want to by the one I have - cause it only made my wallet lighter!

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