diesel rattle in D4D Prado

[peril Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close peril]

My 120 D4D is booked for a cold engine injector test next Tuesday (@ 87,000km). I'm heading to Brissy next week towing a camper and I want to be able to relax on the trip.

Anyone got a 'definitive' link to testing software I can buy for my laptop to test these in house? So many choices and I'd like a PP 'get this one as it works well' post to guide me.

[Callaghan Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close Callaghan]

Watch out Mick & Cheryl our 07 D4D prado just blew-up 160,000Kms,sounds like very similar problem. $12,800 to fix with toyota who blame bad fuel. They always blame bad fuel for their shity over priced diesels...

[pjorek Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close pjorek]

what happened to this thread? lots of pages disappeared.

[Wardos Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Wardos]

For the Aussies in the thread, I wonder why this issue has not made it to one of the Aussie evening news/current affairs programs as yet.. Surely there are enough instances now that would warrant national exposure on TV to get Toyota to lift their game?

[cfryback Find all posts View Profile Close cfryback]

My 120 D4D is booked for a cold engine injector test next Tuesday (@ 87,000km). I'm heading to Brissy next week towing a camper and I want to be able to relax on the trip.

Anyone got a 'definitive' link to testing software I can buy for my laptop to test these in house? So many choices and I'd like a PP 'get this one as it works well' post to guide me.

Well, if Toyota Dealer followed procedure, your injectors should have been pulled 7K Km's ago.....

[peril Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close peril]

Well, if Toyota Dealer followed procedure, your injectors should have been pulled 7K Km's ago.....

The out here for the dealer is that Toyota don't say to do that in 'black and white', it's an interpretation of the valve clearance check process that is the issue. As we have read here when you check valve clearance you can do that without removing injectors. Toyota only need make it 'clear' that this change is required for seal integrity!! Rather than leaving it being interpreted you need to remove injectors just for access reasons.

A simple service memo from Toyota Australia reading " Dear Toyota dealer, please ensure you change all injector seals @ 80,000km on D4D engines".

So of course they weren't changed, this is NSW not SA

[cfryback Find all posts View Profile Close cfryback]

The out here for the dealer is that Toyota don't say to do that in 'black and white', it's an interpretation of the valve clearance check process that is the issue. As we have read here when you check valve clearance you can do that without removing injectors. Toyota only need make it 'clear' that this change is required for seal integrity!! Rather than leaving it being interpreted you need to remove injectors just for access reasons.

A simple service memo from Toyota Australia reading " Dear Toyota dealer, please ensure you change all injector seals @ 80,000km on D4D engines".

So of course they weren't changed, this is NSW not SA

No it isn't that is the whole point....

The GSIC ( Global Service Information Center ) Valve Clearance, Step 7 - clearly states to remove the injectors.

This one from Peru on the 1KD-FTV states that the injectors are to be pulled PRIOR to valve clearance. http://intranet.toyotaperu.com.pe/td...0147800ax.html

[peril Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close peril]

Heheheh, you just proved my point. We have thinking mechanics here in Aussie. They read the manual and determine the injectors don't need to be removed to just check valve clearance in a service. No where in the procedure does it 'specifically' state you are removing the injectors to replace the seals, NOT to get better access to the valves.

I can see the reasons why they interpret it this way and why the Aussies are missing this process. It's a simple thing to make it clearer but seems no one from Toyota Aus. has bothered to do so. Which leaves us untrained types having to try and explain it to a Mechanic who knows more than we do.

That is a tough sell on our part.

[winniliss Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close winniliss]

My injector seals and o-rings got replaced in Katherine NT @ my 80,000 service.

[Rick NZ Member Find all posts View Profile Close Rick NZ]

This is interesting...
As yet there not a single valve clearance that I have had to reset.... NOT ONE on a 1KD
And on TMC's part I think it was luck that removing the injectors was detailed as a step to check the clearances

Dependant on MY spec we are changing these out either at 40k or 45k
Re-using injector pipes on the first inspection and changing them at the 2nd

I feel gutted for those who have lost an engine - but really with the current knowledge out there really is no need for another

[redstorm Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close redstorm]

My experiance with the D$D

I thought i would update my 1KZ-TE to the more fuel efficent and powerful D4D, finally found the vehicle i was looking for, as it was out of town i had an AA inspection done, report came up pretty good, a small oil leak at the turbo.

Purchased and that's when the fun began,
Upon pickup when started it blew a big cloud of white smoke, this turned out to be #4 injector seal.
In the process of diagnosing i pulled the injector values and the volume was over the 12mm3 so all 4 injectors needed replacing.
After fixing the blown seal i dropped the oil to look at the pickup screen with a inspection camera, i couldn't get the camera up the sump plug due to an obstruction that appeared to be the edge of the oil pickup.

Checked how hard it would be to drop the sump. put that in the too hard basket.

So after replacing the seal it was still idling rough, and noisy when cold, sounds like all the valve clearences need to be done. (probably the noise was the injectors).

So decision time as i still had my 1KZ
Reasons to keep the D4D

• Newer design
• More power
• More fuel efficient
• DOHC 16 valve

Cons

• Injectors need replacing $$$
• Injector seals failure common fault (some may disagree)
• Injectors only last about 150k
• Injectors are expensive
• Turbo oil leak $$$
• Unable to verify that the oil pickup was clear
• Rough at idle
• Noisy when cold
• Toyota recommend replacing the seals every 40k $$$
• Taking up too much of my time investigating and working on it when i could be fishing.

When i look at the list its a no brainer to keep the 1KZ, if the only pro's are more power and fuel efficiency, it would be cheaper to just put a 3" turbo back exhaust on the 1KZ and be done with it (1/2 the price of 4 new injectors). All the money saved on fuel in the D4D would go back into keeping it running right.

Luckily i sold the D4D for a little bit more than i paid for it, but overall i came out slightly behind but glad to be rid of it, and ill stick with the reliable 1KZ that now has the 42 Draft Designs catch can that i was going to install on the D4D.

Best of luck with those D4D's cant say i would rush out and buy one again.

[gspy4u Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close gspy4u]

Yeh the D4D's have a few problems but so do a lot of other engines, makes, etc. If you keep an eye on them and service them they are a great motor. I've done 183,000k's and only just had to change out the injectors. No issues with the vehicle at all, still original brake pads, original clutch. Nothing spent on it except normal oil and consumables. So over all not that expensive for the use i have had of it. Reasonably economical more than enough power for towing our almost 2.5t van and plenty of room for the family. I have heard some horror stories for pajero's, patrols, pathfinders, territories and others so yes toyota should have owned up to the injector sheets being a problem and changed them all out but other than that i am a very happy camper.

[redstorm Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close redstorm]

Yeh the D4D's have a few problems but so do a lot of other engines, makes, etc. If you keep an eye on them and service them they are a great motor. I've done 183,000k's and only just had to change out the injectors. No issues with the vehicle at all, .

Theirs your issue right their.
$2500 for new injectors. a 1KZ will do 500k no problem at all without needing major surgery. Your 1KD will most likely be on its 3rd set of injectors by then.

Don't get me wrong i like the D4D it think it is a great engine, but i don't like its higher service costs as it eats up all the savings. I service my 1KZ every 5000 and just installed a catch can, to stop the buildup in the intake.

Until TMC can make the injectors strong enough to last the distance I will stay away and be happy with the bullet proof 1KZ-TE. just my opinion.

[pjorek Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close pjorek]

I don't want to get into the whole 1Kz vs D4D argument but if the injectors need to be replaced every 150k kms and on the 1Kz you need to do Oil Changes every 5000kms that's 15 extra oil changes in 150k kms. Even if you buy the oil yourself and do the job yourself that's $100 per oil change = $1,500.

On top of that fuel economy is around 2L/100km worse off so $3 ($1.50 per litre) per 100km over 150,000 = $4,500 in fuel savings

[peril Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close peril]

Hehhehe, I've had both engines, the D4D worries me but boy does it perform heaps better. I'm hopeful with a bit of preventative maintenance it will last just as long.

PS I think you'll find oil 'should' be changed every 5000km in both Diesels if you want them to last. Toyota doesn't need your car to last 500,000km, they prefer you ware it out quickly and buy a new one.

Had my D4D injectors cold tested today, all good @ 87,000km.